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Sight Screen

Tuesday, August 09, 2005

The GC factor

The question asked is, if it is the basics letting the team down, isn't that where the coach is supposed to come in?
Not. He can't, unfortunately, grab catches for Dhoni... or even whisper into his ears what shot to play to a straight full ball... all his work happens before the first ball is bowled...
...and after the game has been won and lost; what will be worth watching is how he hopes to enforce the right mindset on the team. Drop erring players, telling them in the process, if we are going to lose anyways, we might as well lose with new players? In other words, the key period for me is now -- end of this series, to the beginning of the next.

38 Comments:

  • We passed on the opportunity to have Tom Moody as a coach ...

    And SL is now reaping the rewards ...

    By Blogger Anis, at 12:21  

  • Prem
    No coach can improve the lot of this Indian team. As I had said before, you can get the cricket coaches, the best sports psychologists, the best physiotherapists, the best dietitian, etc, etc, etc and we will stil end up losers. We do not have a winning attitude and changing personnel is not going to change our fortunes.

    By Blogger rahul, at 12:22  

  • There's a limit to what a coach can do to a bunc of idiots. It is important to have brains along with talent. And I dont think has anything to do with dedication, determination, sincerety or effort. It is just lack of brains and we shouldnt be blaming guys like Dhoni for being stupid.

    By Blogger Toney, at 12:23  

  • ah well thats another finals lost

    what is now? 2 won and 14 lost in tournaments featuring 3 or more teams

    By Blogger JD, at 12:24  

  • The problem is that set batsmen are afraid of taking risks during middle overs. Yuvraj scored only 2 fours. They know that Murali and Vaas were going to choke them in the end. Why not pile up runs before their arrival or hasten their arrival?

    By Blogger murlichucks, at 12:25  

  • really really bad defeat ... add one more to the lost final kitty. GC cant do much like Prem says people get selected becos they know the basics here those things are in question .. fact is all the players except dhoni perhaps have played more than 50 matches so there is no excuse at all

    By Blogger Karthik, at 12:25  

  • just an observation:
    it's interesting what blogging has done to spectators.
    i mean, we're no longer just spectators, we're commentators too.
    is that taking away from the sheer joy of just watching? maybe that's another topic for another day.:)

    By Blogger dna, at 12:25  

  • Dravid in the presentation ceremony...


    "Our bowlers let us down. Actually our fielders too..hmmm...u know what ...i think the batsman too...
    hey...how about the keeper. yes he too..."

    By Blogger The Suds, at 12:25  

  • Prem, who would you consider the erring players

    By Blogger Abe, at 12:25  

  • you mean 10 days.. :). The next series is gonna start from Aug 23 and the NZ has Bond in full speed.. It will be good to see if our batsman can cope with the extra speed.

    By Blogger Balaji, at 12:26  

  • and to make matters worse..next fixture is tour of zimbabwe...wont be an indicator of progress and improvements.

    By Blogger riemann1, at 12:26  

  • This loss will hurt!!!

    Not the end of world but we need to play the finals like any other game. Get the basics right!

    By Blogger rajeev, at 12:26  

  • we had scored 10 boundaries in the first 6 overs; in the next 40 overs we had 5-6

    middle order is clogged with players who cant do anything against spin

    By Blogger JD, at 12:27  

  • prem:
    as we've all been indulging in it for the past few hours, there's no dearth of pointing out negatives in this team / game. What positives would you take out of it?

    By Blogger dna, at 12:28  

  • We should do well in the next series as Murali won't be playing for NZ/Zim :).

    By Blogger murlichucks, at 12:28  

  • murlichucks:
    don't think murali was that much of a factor in this series, as prem pointed out earlier.

    By Blogger dna, at 12:29  

  • Prem has gone to sleep guys :)

    By Blogger murlichucks, at 12:29  

  • Bring back SRT :-) Somebody give him a new elbow. SG, why not urs? After all, ur days r numbered....

    Hmm, hope the pitches in Zim are at least true. Bond will have a good time and so would RD and VVS (if he's selected)

    By Blogger Toney, at 12:30  

  • Prem : I hope GC does good research with all the samples he collected from the 'experiment'. Sometimes I wonder, if all these experiments fail...go the old way....send in Dhoni, GC, VS, SRT..whoever to open...tonk the ball...atleast the failure rate wouldnt have been any worse ;-)

    But seriously, as you said, lets wait and watch if we see any steps in the right direction after this series. And I hope that SRT doesnt play in zimbabwe....so atleast we get to see what has changed with the rest !

    Those basic fielding problems, idiotic brainless batting (mind you, not less on skill...Pathan, zaheer all can hit also...and have done it in less pressure situations)....

    This was a game where top order can hardly be blamed....except maybe RD to some extent....

    And there is a fair share of blame for the management..the think-tank also....some pretty obvious wrong moves

    By Blogger worma, at 12:30  

  • 10-0-35-2 bowling 5 in the last ten and you are saying that he was not much of a factor? You must be kidding.

    By Blogger murlichucks, at 12:31  

  • How come the same bunch of idiots performed previously?

    Albeit skill is needed, but that is expected at this level of any sport.

    Do you think Tiger Woods is think of his technique when teeing off, putting or driving? He is definitely not! Techinque is taken for granted at this level. He is focusing on the target.

    Likewise, the team needs to focus on what they are doing in the middle - this as I always say calls for planning, contigency planning, constant analysis and implementation - that means the leader i.e. Capt is responsible. Doesn't look like we have that problem resolved yet. So let us start from their, rather than GC saying select yr 11 and then the best man be the Capt. Obviously that is not working, because to win or lose is not what we look at during the initial series (GC/RD) - we look for effort, playing to plan and then failing is okay. As long as we move on and learn which I am sure RD will, not sure about GC and the rest.

    By Blogger LAWRIE, at 12:33  

  • Sadly, I think like someone else mentioned, this is supposedly the core of the WC'07 team!

    I was going to book tickets to Trinidad, but not sure if this is the core, that I want to go there :-)

    By Blogger RPM, at 12:35  

  • Dravid has done nothing to say that he will be a better captain than Ganguly. I think he will go back to deputising to the Maharaj.

    By Blogger murlichucks, at 12:35  

  • Just rename India A team to India and vice versa. You think the verdict would have been different if Rao, Raina and Yadav were included int he team? Atleast, these guys would have gained some experience.

    Babi

    By Blogger babi, at 12:36  

  • To me the turning point was Sehwag's dismissal. He needed to stay till the end and win it for the team. I am sure even if he got out on 80 around the 12th over, the team facing an asking rate of 4.6 or so would have managed to fold somehow.

    By Blogger murlichucks, at 12:38  

  • Experience at what - losing?

    No that can become a bad habit!!

    To win a Cap one must prove they deserve to e worthy and not just experiments. Afterall this is the Finals of teh Tri-Series.

    To learn then please go back to school.

    By Blogger LAWRIE, at 12:39  

  • Guys,

    I am not making any excuses here, but is the Indian team really THAT bad (yes...at this point). But it isn't all a collective shambles. It looks like things have steadily slipped off the highs of 2003-2004 when there was a lot more attention to detail, and a lot more keenness. Well, the result is there to see.

    Can you think of more than one thing that lost the match for us? Here are a few:
    1) At least 20 extra runs given away in the form of wides, no balls, misfields, inadequate pressure on the batsmen running twos, etc.
    2) Bad calls (or lack thereof) in running between the wickets
    3) An inability to remember how to release the pressure - singles! Technically, 100 of 90 balls (& 8 wickets in hand) is a stroll in the park if every ball was at least a single. There will always be gimme balls. It didn't look like we remembered that.

    There are so many more that come to mind, but the underlying theme is one of slacking off in some respect.

    In hindsight, I feel that 5 bowlers was not a bad plan. The execution was far below par.

    Right now, we feel that these guys are a bunch of whatevers, but I feel that this same lot can (& have) taken the fight to the best in the past. They just forget things more than they remember....

    Sorry to sound like an apologist, that wasn't my aim.

    By Blogger Jeetu, at 13:30  

  • I agree with Jeetu's thoughts here!!

    The same team has down well before - when I say team I mean nucleus.

    In my earlier comments I alluded to leadership, planning and implementation. Thereafter its analysis and planning yet again for the future. The starting point is getting the Captaincy issue out in the open and settled once and for all.

    We then move on - not to build - but play some serious but-kicking cricket of old.

    By Blogger LAWRIE, at 14:00  

  • Isn't it clear to everyone that India lost because they didn't account for the Murali factor? We should have tonked a couple of boundaries of lesser bowlers in order to have the luxury of scoring only 3 an over of Murali. Trying some mighty blows against this master craftsman (however illegitimate his action is in my opinion) is only suicidal. The final assault should have come before the run rate climbed to 6 an over. As simple as that. We could have still lost wickets to other bowlers but the risk would have been minimal. Well, we would have cursed Yuvraj for getting out in his 20s or 30s. I guess Indian cricketers try to save themselves first and then think of an Indian victory. The only guy who genuinely wants to win at all costs is Sehwag and unfortunately he got out early. Great knock by him though. He set up the game nicely for India as we needed only 5 RPO when he left.

    By Blogger murlichucks, at 14:19  

  • indians does not deserve to win...the spiritless way they play...i am an indian and I am happy that SL won...when you really play with your heart we don't even mind them losing...really...these are a bunch of losers who get to earn big bucks...bring back the passion for the game it doesn't matter who plays...look at them, lost three straigh games to SL and two from winning positions...

    By Blogger Abdul, at 14:44  

  • "Drop the erring players"... whom do you drop from the squad? Everyone in the squad is guilty of forgetting the basics...

    And you have people like YS who come back with a superlative effort when being threatened which ensures that he is in for the next 20 matches or so...

    The bench is not showing promise as well (agreed that JP is untested). Will GC have the guts to go against the establishment and take harsh measures against some seniors...

    Where has the hunger that the Indians had during WC 2003 and during the tours of Aus and Pak 2003-2004 gone?

    The leadership issue should be decided on a priority.

    By Blogger Kannan, at 17:43  

  • Murlichucks, It is too simple to justify a win or loss as you say. The problem cannot be assessed game to game, but the problem is far greater than we see on the face of things.

    I think it was a blogger called raj who said that don't judge captaincy by win/loss but by overall approach. Quite frankly we can do the same for the whole team. But even then it is a clueless team that we have now and a clueless leadership.

    Quite frankly accepting the facts, faults and building on them is important. We learn more from losses than victories - by that token India should be riding high. Unfortunately, we learn a lot just like in the academic field - the problem with India in general is implementation of that learned knowledge to yield tangible results.

    In Australia's case the even learn from victories i.e. how to win a test inside 3 days for instance.

    By Blogger LAWRIE, at 18:09  

  • This triseries:

    Only 3 batsmen showed up - RD, MK, YS
    Only 1 bowler showed up - AN

    Flashback to the Pak series earlier this year:

    Only 3 batsmen showed up - RD, MD, VS
    Only 1 bowler showed up - AN

    What kind of a team is this where at a given time, only 4 people decide to perform while the rest of them losers just show up to make up the numbers.

    Unless we find 11 guys who are willing to contribute day in and day out, there is no hope.

    There was no hunger on the field. Overthrows, dropped catches, missed runouts, atrocious running between the wickets, irresponsible batting - the list goes on and on. It would be better if the BCCI would just pick under-19 guys who can can be taught the basics properly by GC. There is no point excepting anything but losses from this choker bunch that prides itself on making it to the finals 18 times.

    By Blogger AA, at 20:51  

  • Prem, if you compare Indian cricket team in 5 or so years to that of teams in 80's, one thing missing is hunger to win. To me, 80's team was the best. Each player was capable of turning matches in India favor. Players looked like sportsmen compared to current set..who look like models.
    Except RD, none can make it to any other intl team. This really shows lack of talent in India.
    No matter how much people analyse, and come up with perms and combs, net effect is zero.
    I gave up on this team. If we scan domestic teams, there are no talented youngsters. Near future (atleast another 5 yrs) looks bleak. Like someone suggested, get U-19 players, because they are coachable.

    By Blogger Rajg, at 21:41  

  • Prem... you had mentioned earlier that you would not mind if we lose the tri-series providing the team management work towards building a team and try various combinations

    Look at what happened... we neither won the series nor did we end up with a winnable combination!!!

    By Blogger Kannan, at 03:11  

  • ..work towards building a team is different from ending up with a winnable combination ! Anyway...there were some learnings from the series....like Raina and Rao are not up to the mark, need to look for others as well. Dhoni should be developed first as a proper keeper, his batting left un-tinkered. Pathan was mostly good, Nehra should never be left out of ODIs. Kumble will win only those matches which we should anyway have won, Laxman should concentrate on becoming a world class reliable test batsmen rather than trying to be too much and ending up with nothing.

    By Blogger worma, at 05:37  

  • I agree with poster "aa". BCCI would do better by making GC the coach of the U-17 or U-19 team. This bunch of seniors are too thick skinned to be transformed. Losing has become part of the routine. Same old excuses, same old mistakes, same old story. Not much hope for them to turn the corner. Its not just this series. The downslide started last year during the Asia cup. There is nothing GC can do with this bunch. Even after spending 2-3 weeks in camps, their fielding lacky energy, throws lack accuracy and bowling lacks direction and planning. How many times have we seen Zaheer concede more than 10 runs in his first over? How many times have the spinners strayed on the leg stump? Comare with bowlers from other teams. This is not due to lack of confidence. Plain and simple, this is lack of "ability" . These players are incapable of batting, bowling or fielding well. Once in a while they perform well - thats an aberration, a fluke. As long as there are no consequences of losing, this team will continue to lose. What has Dhoni got to lose by dropping catches? Or Zaheer got to lose by bowling wide? He knows he will be on the plane to Zimbabwe anyway. Where's the motivation? There should be a carrot and stick policy. Spare the rod and spoil the child - these guys need a beating on the backside. Best would be take a U-19 or U-17 team with only commited players like RD and SRT to Zimbabwe. Surely they can do no worse that this current pathetic bunch?

    By Blogger Tiger, at 10:44  

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