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Sight Screen

Monday, October 31, 2005

Blocked

... and so, will settle back, enjoy the rest of the game, snooze for a bit, get to work, and see you guys later in my day. Meanwhile -- enjoy a 3-0 lead, guys... been a long time coming, this kind of emphatic performance

183 Comments:

  • 3-0 is great. Great job by Indian Team. Change at top made a big difference. Way to go..India.

    By Blogger Rajg, at 05:57  

  • yes- it is great to see this resurgence ...!!Looks like everything is going for India - at the moment...!!!
    What is the flip side risk to this dream scenario..? I mean - what can go wrong...!!!

    By Blogger ravi2206, at 06:35  

  • well do we still need what is his name patel??? as a keeper

    By Blogger tombaan, at 06:35  

  • What an inning by Dhoni !! he knocked out the stuffing out of the so called Lions. India needs to examine this match. How can they allow 299 after 117/2 in 30 overs. The problems began there. I was a bit uneasy when Dravid got out but Dhon's continous hitting nullified the disadvantage of Yuvaraj's well documented inability to play spin (this straight away rules him out of test side.. I hope common sense prevails here to include Kaif)and Rao's inability to play anything (to be fair, when he came in- he just needed to hang in and let Dhoni do the job but there will be other circumstances where more might be expected and Rao seems to be too raw for such a demand..for example, when he had 3 dot balls, he hit a 6..that shows lack of imagination..all that was required a single off every ball to keep the momentum going).
    Coming back to Dhoni...it was indeed Diwali Dhamka !!!!!!!!

    By Blogger Crick_Love, at 06:46  

  • fantastic win and great consistency so far shown by india..incl. all the experimentation that is working...on the flip side we should not get too carried away either, ravi: still a lot of things can get no wrong..number 1 being true to india's style..getting inconsistent and complacent being the main enemies..as one way to look at it is that it is still three matches against a more or less toothless sri lanka (india's usual nemesis sj is injured and out of form, other than ks not much of a batting performance or top order not really in form and less we talk about their bowling is better...but looks like gc and rd will not make same mistakes..that is the main hope for us

    By Blogger indianfansrcrazy, at 06:58  

  • all the kali puja ganguly has been conducting against chappell seem not be working :>

    By Blogger tombaan, at 07:01  

  • emphatic? what about our sorry bowling? everyone forgets that in the euphoria of dhoni's innings :-)

    By Blogger Mock Turtle, at 07:07  

  • Turtle: When was the last time you smiled and were HAPPY?

    By Blogger Mount_Cleverest, at 07:10  

  • @Indianfanscrazy: Yes, I agree with you. One major thing that can still be their nemesis (having seen our team over a period of time) is Complacency..!Only hope GC / RD combination can ensure that it doesn't happen.
    @Crick_love: Without getting into 'me-good-you-no-good' discussion (and thereby screwing the existing feel-good atmosphere in this forum), I feel you are being too harsh about a youngster when you said 'Rao's inability to play anything...' - Give him sometime mate ... after all, he is a youngster who has hardly had any chances to establish himself yet...!!!

    By Blogger ravi2206, at 07:13  

  • The powerplay is certainly going to change the way the composition of the team is going to selected moving forward. Here are some of my observation

    Bowling:

    * Because 60% of the overs (20 powerplay + 10 overs for slog) are going to in the phase where batsmen are going to take charge, teams cannot afford to have bits and pieces bowl those 30.
    * Spinners would be under tremendous disadvantage as field restrictions would make it very challenging for them to bowl during those 30.
    * Unless there is an early fall of wickets, 2 spinner strategy would be very risky as they would need to bowl nearly 20 overs between overs 18 to 42. (Murali karthik struggled today when he was brought very late in the middle. If he had been bowling earlier, he would have been restrictive. But it would have meant Bhaji would have bowled later)
    * Because of the powerplay, teams need to complete nearly 70% of strike bowlers even before it is half-way thru (Irfan + Agarkar have been bowling an average 7 overs each in the first spell). Considering this scenario, it would make sense to have (3 fast bowlers in the lineup + 1 spinner + 1 all rounder)
    * Considering that the game is now favoring the batsmen the most, it would make sense to have a bowler as a super sub as if one of the main bowler struggles, you would need addl options to cover up



    For powerplay(s), batting teams should have designated pinch hitters. Gone are the days when you had a quick start, then cruise control mode and then start offensive attack. If team takes advantage of the powerplays, chances are the bowling team is going to be under major disadvantage as they would have elapsed majority of the bowling quota of their main strike bowlers which makes way for the rest of the batting to take charge after power play overs.

    India should continously send the likes of Pathan, Harbhajan, Dhoni to play the powerplays as they are more orthodox and can frustrate the strike bowlers. A guy like Kaif / Dravid (even though he has improved, I still wud want to retain him for the finish) / Venu should not be brought up early in the 20 overs slot. (I am making an assumption that the powerplay wud be completed in the first 25 overs which wud be the case most of the time).

    Today match, Yuvi and Venu were struggling to graft runs as they wasted too many balls. I am unsure if Venu can fit in the current lineup when we already have kaif and Dravid. It would make sense for Yuvi to come up either during the powerplay or during slog. It will certainly force him to start scoring from the word go. If he comes during the 20-40 over mark, he is vulnerable to spin bowling. He also is confused between being aggressive and passive.

    By Blogger rk, at 07:25  

  • mount_cleverest, never :)

    By Blogger Mock Turtle, at 07:30  

  • the heights of pessimism:
    Calling Rao's 6 "a lack of imagination"
    Finding reason to exclude Yuvraj from the Test team

    hilarious.

    India's bowling was poor from over 20 onwards. Simply put it was the inability to take wickets. SL did well to deny us those wickets in that regard, and they put up a decent total.
    I say decent not because of Dhoni's batting (which, I gotta say, humiliated Sangakarra's effort), but because of the following factors:
    We had the advantage of an extra batsman
    20, as opposed to 15, overs of field restrictions
    Flat as a pancake pitch

    In fact Dravid clarified this, he thought the bowlers did alright to keep them to 298.
    All in all, I don't think I've seen such a big and explosive inning while chasing in a long time, and a real pleasure and privilege to watch. Can't wait for game 4, to see what our team has in store for us.
    SL, well, I think should be preparing to go home.

    By Blogger Dhruv Deepak, at 07:30  

  • i think after we win the fourth game if we do they need to rest srt for the remaining and let gambhir play....i am not sure about agarkar and pathan as the only bowlers. I still would like zaheer back if he gets his form and fitness back....not right way. balaji in last couple of games in the national tournament seems to be struggling....sreesanth should be player more now on to see if he has in him to play at that level....harbhajan has come back in good form which is good....yuvraj needs to get back in form has struggled in one dayers for a long time other than centuries aginst second rated windies and zimbabwe....venu needs to be given more opps if doesnot fit in the scheme raina should be given a play in ....anyway signing off now need to shower and get into the grind..........

    By Blogger tombaan, at 07:37  

  • My worry is none of the lower order has hd sufficient time in the middle. JPY, VGR, SR, HS, AA all need to bat a bit because come a cunch itution, we will be found wanting.
    Numbers 1 through 4 hav all performed so far.. But what about 5 through 11?

    By Blogger SHRI, at 07:54  

  • tombaan,
    Please don't mention bringing Zaheer back-- players that constantly need to be motivated to train, by threatening their spot in the team, is not what India needs
    Sree Santh definitely deserves more of an opportunity- he's got a great attitude and he performed credibly in his first ODI when one considers that all the seamers took a pasting on that wicket
    BTW, I think Yuvraj had a century against NZ in Zim?
    I reckon Venu will be out once Kaif is fit.

    I'm in such a good mood after that match, as I'm sure all of you are as well, but question begs to be answered.
    With Dhoni displaying such a good head on his shoulders by appropriately picking which balls to hit and taking sincles off the others, should he consistently bat up the order? I'm really not sure where I stand on the issue after today's innings.

    By Blogger Sahir, at 07:58  

  • shri,
    well Pathan will likely bat in the lower and he certainly seems in good nick. Although neither scored many, Yadav and Rao both had some time at the crease in the second and third ODIs respectively. However, I do share your concern about the lower order, in general, not getting much of a hit- but I'll take it!

    By Blogger Sahir, at 08:16  

  • Also, rahuls captaincy lack flair. Usage of Yuvi, Sehwag, Sachin and venu or lack of .. forgetting to let the umpire know of the power play...field settings by rote... we have out batted and out bowled the lankans.. but have we out thought them?

    By Blogger SHRI, at 08:22  

  • shri,
    We have certainly out thought the Lankans- sending Pathan and now Dhoni up the order are two examples
    I feel Dravid's captaincy has been quite good. For the most part he has rotated his bowlers quite well, although he probably should have withdrawn Karthik a little earlier today.

    By Blogger Sahir, at 08:26  

  • sahir.. i beg to differ.. i think we are doing our fundamentals right.. and sachin firing in the first two games is a big bonus... but captaincy wise...Rahul plays by the numbers... maybe needs trime to settle in his job.. But definately more conservative in his approach compared to other world captais at the moment..

    BTW have u noticed the cross batted hoick rahul tried to play today... I nearly fell off my chir laughing..

    By Blogger SHRI, at 08:29  

  • Rao deserves more chances as he was fantastic in the Challenger Series. Also his first class average is 51. Only thing we have to see about him whether he has international temperament or not. I believe that being a good cricketer is little bit different thing that having a good temperament to be successful in international arena. Take the example of Virender Sehwag. He is not technically that sound but his temperament is fabulous which is has made him top batsman in the world. Whereas if you see Dinesh Mongia. He always does well at domestic level or in county cricket, but never did well in international cricket. Dhoni's temperament is also amaging. He or for that matter Pathan is bound to be successful.
    About the match...who has seen these matches would agree that this is not like Ind-Pak where we were up 2-0 and yet lost the series. Here we are playing differently. Also that time there was no GC and we had Ganguly at number 3 (adding negative value to the team), Sachin injured. But this time that negative is out and Sachin is adding positive values. Also Ganguly was not in a mood to listen anybody and now all are working together and everything is flexible. Things are being done keeping team as a whole in mind and not an individual. Nobody is just greedy towards number 3 or anything. Best thing about RD is that he never tries to twist things in his favour. I hope this is an start of new era for Indian cricket if we can keep Ganguly out forever, both in ODI as well in Test matches. It used to be said that he gives chances to youngsters. But if you closely see he has backed wrong people only and has not given chances to deserving ones like Kaif.

    By Blogger Shivam, at 08:32  

  • Actually Shivam, on form, Saurav is the best sight in Indian cricket. And quite frankly, if the selectors can sort out the captaincy mess, i believe that Saurav has a lot to offer this team. And with regards to Sauravs ability to spot talent, no one, and absolutely no one in the Indian setup coms close to his ability to identify talent.

    Saurav on a lean trot is a divisive factor. Saurav on song with his role identified is an altogether different proposition.

    Sachin and Saurav opening with Sehwag down the order with Dhoni and Yuvi and Rahul and kaif playing the anchors... hello World Cup 2007.. :)

    By Blogger SHRI, at 08:40  

  • But Shri,
    What to do about his inability to play fast bowling? He has really proved that he can't play at least those deliveries which are bothering him since last 2-3 years. Is it not long enough now to believe that he can overcome those problems? I also like him as a batsman. But his problem which those particular deliveries are huge and also his fielding will not survive in today's scenario. Gone are those days when Jadeja was best fielder. Now all are coming with good hands on the field. Actually world has changed in recent years for India as well.

    By Blogger Shivam, at 08:47  

  • And also...whatever he gave to the team he has taken everything back in last 2 years. He was ruling like a king and not as a devoted captain for the team and cricket fans.

    By Blogger Shivam, at 08:50  

  • Shivam,

    Based on the media reports, Saurav has been doing the hard yards regarding fitness .. Also, wickets in the Windies do not afford the kind of bounce that say perth will. saurav also has an excellent record against the Proteas and the Windies..

    Also, with the new super sub rule, saurav can also be fitted as a batsman who can bowl as against a bowler who can bat ?

    By Blogger SHRI, at 08:52  

  • shri
    if ganguly is in the WC, we can as well kiss the trophy good bye.

    By Blogger The Suds, at 08:53  

  • Shivam,

    I blame the selectors and the Board for the current mess.. And it all started in SL when RD was the interim captain and Saurav was serving his ban. The selectors should have clarified then and there that RD is the interim captain or the permanent captain and the role Saurav had to play in the team.

    not having done that, and then side stepping the whole SG-GC issue, they have made an already bad situation worse. And to cap it off, they wanted Saurav to prove his fitness ( and not form) and now that he has done that, they are pussy footing..

    I would rather that they get Sachin Saurav, rahul, sehwag and GC in a room, assign roles and responsibilities and set expectations from each of these gentlemen and take indian cricket forward.

    But before that, there is the small issue of the elections.. :)

    By Blogger SHRI, at 08:57  

  • as usual we are back to sg bashing again...it is worse than a broken record....but going back to the team i think the top order experiments will come to an end soon. once mk returns..then the batting order should read:

    1. vs
    2. srt
    3. mk (with rotation from dhoni, pathan, etc. whenever needed for pinch hitting and keeping the opposition guessing)
    4. yuvi
    5. rd
    6. dhoni

    i dont think unless anyone in the top fails to perform over a period of time, there will be too many changes there unless gc wants to rest srt once in a while to keep him fresh for wc 07. however, from 7-11 incl the selection of the bowlers will still go thru quite a few changes. not sure jp is a long term all rounder choice for the team but dont think there are too many options currently there either. hopefully, murali does not become rd's boy like we think of aa and st. altho, aa is still lot more useful than murali. the fast bowling combination looks pretty unsettled with not too many options for partnering with ip as yet. ofcourse, there is still time for ss and few others to be tried out but not bets on who will come out on top. we have to remember how our pace attack combined to give us the real edge in the last world cup and chances are that we dont need more than one regular spinner in the side. how was rd's captaincy today btw..did not get a chance to see the match hence asking..not sure sl grabbed the initiative fully to make a better score..

    By Blogger indianfansrcrazy, at 08:58  

  • Suds,

    we have had our best run in the WC after 83 under SG. Surely he has something more to offer... And for all his foibles and faults, the man has guts.. Give him that...

    And the current Indian set up is missing one player who will stand at mid -on or close in and yap away at the batsman.. And give back as good as he gets.. And believe u me, Saurav can do that and more..

    By Blogger SHRI, at 09:00  

  • just wishful thinking... Amit Mishra given a run against the lankans in the tests... Ambati rayadu given a run during the Windies tour..

    ZK, AN and LB rehabed..

    VRV and RPS given a chance if we seal the series against the lankans at Pune...

    and India becoming a stronger test team..

    and while at it.. why not win the series against the proteas in SA?

    :)

    By Blogger SHRI, at 09:04  

  • shri,

    agree about your sg posts but dont see (based on the current situation) how he comes back to the team until few more series with this same combination and also the top order failing. unless, he replaces jp which may not be a bad idea but sg's bowling is not that good anymore.

    but, i would be happy to see his batting on song anytime.

    By Blogger indianfansrcrazy, at 09:09  

  • This is for those of you who watched. Did Dravid miss telling the umpires that power play is 'on'? and if so..what impact it had? did it mean, India had to bowl more overs with power play, even though the field was set that it is already 'on'.

    By Blogger Crick_Love, at 09:12  

  • I think in place of doing to much experiment after wrapping the series, we should continue winning and do just little bit of experiments ( I mean by bring too many youngsters). Winning is a habit which we are trying to get. We should bring youngsters but not too many. We should ensure that we don't lose as we did in Bangladesh tour. Target should be 7-0. Alghough I hope 5-2 or 6-1 is not very difficult looking at the momentum.

    By Blogger Shivam, at 09:12  

  • What is best thing I have seen about Srilanka is that they believe in winning. You will see them bringing their best side against BAN as well. This is what has made them number 2 ODI team and not just the talent they have. We have even more talent than them but we get satisfied after winning the series or after gaining success for a small perieod of time (as it was after qualifying for the WC final).

    By Blogger Shivam, at 09:15  

  • Shivam... with Sl under the cosh, we should aim for 7-0.. but we should also try to get s many in the current rotation an oppurtunity with both bat and ball.. eg.. i wouldnt mind JPY and VGR opeining in the 5th ODI if we win at Pune.. How the team management does it is going to be interesting...
    Also, would love to see the lower order get an extended bat.. and some of the bits and pieces bowlers getting some more oppurtunities...

    just hedgig our bets till WC 2007..

    Wouldnt mind if the team actually drafted VRV and Amit Mishra and some of the other up and coming players for ODI 6 and 7..

    By Blogger SHRI, at 09:18  

  • @crick_love
    I was watching more or less all the time (except I went for lunch for 15-20min). But I think Indians completed their power play exactly in 20th over. I don't think there was eny such issue. RD did inform the umpire. But not 100% sure. If anybody else can clarify.

    By Blogger Shivam, at 09:18  

  • Shivam.. the power play commnt was wrt the last odi when india bowled with the field in and RD forgot to tell te ump that he was taking the power play.. no such issues in this ODI

    By Blogger SHRI, at 09:21  

  • @Shri,

    I agree with all your points except that openning is a specialyst job. Do experiments number 3 and beyond. But trying GG is fine but not others for the opening slot. It is good to have more than two specialyst openers available but not more than that. And at the start of the game actually most of the time you don't have game really open so strategy making only comes when a wicket falls, specially when you have blasters like Sachin and Sehwag opening or even GG when he will open he will be a blaster as well. Isn't it ? :)

    By Blogger Shivam, at 09:23  

  • shri,,so in the last ODI, did India have to bowl more overs with power play since RD did not inform?

    By Blogger Crick_Love, at 09:26  

  • GG wont open.. I think GG in the team is a bad selection.. With MK coming back, it would make sense for MK to come at 3 and RD at ... Yuvi at 4 and MSD at 7..

    All the same i would like some of these new kids to have an extended time at the crease and alsotry them out at other spots just in keeping with the rotation policy..

    eg.. suppose the wicketis doing a little.. wouldnt it make sense for someone correct like VGR to open ad SRT or VS come lower down the order....

    anyways, people with a higher pay grade than I ahave been appointed to do this job... more power to them..

    By Blogger SHRI, at 09:31  

  • crick.. that is true .. in the 16th over RD rought the field in and failed to inform the ump.. realised his mistke halfway thru the over and then had a word wit the ump.. no loss except we bowled an over that hould logically have been a PP over..

    By Blogger SHRI, at 09:32  

  • check this out

    http://content-ind.cricinfo.com/indvsl/content/story/223752.html

    By Blogger SHRI, at 09:36  

  • has all traffic to this blog stopped? I havent seen a single comment update in the last hour :)

    By Blogger SHRI, at 09:58  

  • did u guys see this.. This is what makes me hate the POMS a lot.
    http://in.rediff.com/cricket/2005/oct/30venues.htm

    the POMS can have bouncy tracks when Aussies/ or any international team go there to bounce them on but will not play to the home team's benefit...I like Aussies as they always relish playing on different pithces (may be they have a world class talent in warney huh!)
    hahaha

    By Blogger Balaji, at 10:02  

  • does anyone seriously think gg will be able to make it to the indian odi team?

    By Blogger indianfansrcrazy, at 10:14  

  • shivam,
    Just for your info, Sri Lanka are no longer the number 2 side in the world; now ranked 4th.

    By Blogger Sahir, at 10:17  

  • How about this for you stat lovers:
    After 22 matches (fairly significant number), Mahendra Singh Dhoni now has the highest average in ODI cricket as well as the highest strike rate! I wonder if that's ever happened?
    Average: 49.73
    SR: 108.90

    By Blogger Sahir, at 10:19  

  • sahir
    I still think zaheer is a good bowler has better skills than agarkar....i do feel sreesanth should be tried more
    I dont think yuvraj had that hundred against new zealand it was against zimbabwe.....

    By Blogger tombaan, at 10:20  

  • Balaji,

    Poms will whinge.. thats the nature of the beast.. And if they dont like the venues or the iternary, they can shove it in any bodily orifice they deem fit.. And talking of venues, since when did Hove or Taunton or Chester le Street become big time tourism venues for the Indian fan?

    bit rich that CMJ and SB should be bringing this up now...

    By Blogger SHRI, at 10:27  

  • Tombaan.. agree with u 100%. However, ZK needs to get his thinking right.. too many breakdowns at crucial junctures ( both mental and physical)..

    By Blogger SHRI, at 10:28  

  • shri
    "BTW have u noticed the cross batted hoick rahul tried to play today... I nearly fell off my chir laughing.. "

    Cross-batted hoick???
    You certainly weren't watching too closely-- there was nothing cross-batted about it. He played with a straight bat trying to work the ball to the onside with the spin as you should do against an offie that turns it as much as Murali. Provide, of course, it is the offie... the ball went straight on, Dravid did not pick it and got the leading edge.

    Not aggressive captaincy?
    Dravid is the first Indian captain I have seen in a long time actually bring in close catchers during the middle overs. While, aggressive field placings can be very difficult to do on belters, in the Sri Lankan triangular Dravid's field placings defending low totals were about as aggressive as I've ever seen. He consistently had short-legs, silly mid-wickets, and slips in place.
    Bottom line, the proof is in the pudding... 3 of 3 and the team is responding fabulously well with him as a leader. You're not going to do everything right everyday, but so far there certainly has been no lack of effort or commitment on display from the players.

    By Blogger Sahir, at 10:29  

  • BTW, aggressive captaincy does not require yelling, overt display of emotion, or wild waving of the arms after each over. All it requires is tactical nous, something Dravid has plenty of!

    By Blogger Sahir, at 10:32  

  • not disputing the commitment of the players at all.. and talking of aggressive captaincy, RD will be more prone to do it by the numbrs in crunh sitautions... 3 out of 3 is fair.. but am waiting for the fan reaction when this team slips... wonder who the daggers will be out for then...

    By Blogger SHRI, at 10:32  

  • Tendulkar's performance certainly helped the side big-time, but don't forget Dravid's fabulous knock in the first ODI that got him the man of the match award

    By Blogger Sahir, at 10:33  

  • sahir,

    u insult my cricketing intelligence by your explanation of aggressive captaincy..If captaincy was all about tcticl nous and nothing else....sachin would have been the greatest captain ever... and seriously.. not doing anythig also wins u games.. vide Azhar...

    RD is a thinking player.. does that translate to thinking captaincy.. and to aggressive captaincy.. time will tell..

    By Blogger SHRI, at 10:35  

  • sahir...about the highest average thing...how does KP do?...I think he should have a fairly high avg and strike rate?

    By Blogger worma, at 10:36  

  • Sahir..

    RD was captain when Sl was 92/6 chasing 222 and e all know what happened.. 3 wins does not a summer make...

    By Blogger SHRI, at 10:36  

  • shri,
    "when this team slips"

    I'd say if this team slips; the way they are playing right now, there is a definite possibility of a hot streak coming up. At home, I would certainly favor them over RSA and the tests against a Sri Lanka side low on confidence, I would suspect, after the lopsided defeat they are likely to suffer in this ODI series. The Pakistani tour will be the real test.

    By Blogger Sahir, at 10:37  

  • sahir - MSD probably also has the highest % of sixes per match..

    By Blogger Tiger, at 10:38  

  • shri,
    Dravid does not bowl, so unfortunately he cannot mop up the tail. Not to mention, in that match an umpiring error let Chandana off with the score at 112 I believe-- a 7th wicket there would have made all the difference in the world.
    Agree that 3 wins does not a summer make, but it is more than just winning, it is the manner in which the team is playing. I have not seen them play this well for a very, very long time.

    By Blogger Sahir, at 10:39  

  • big time changes in the ICC official ODI team rankings.. NZ and Lanka falling and SAF rising.. India still 7th..

    By Blogger Tiger, at 10:42  

  • If India wins 7-0 then guess what..SL will be 7th in the ODI rankings..What a turnaround that will be!!

    By Blogger ilovecricket, at 10:42  

  • sahir...to be precise...we haven't played this kind of buoyant one day cricket since the Pak tour ODI series...

    By Blogger worma, at 10:43  

  • this team continues to surprise me! that was an awesome performance... before the series i was thinking if India finished 2-5 to SL that would be a reasonable step forward given how the team had slipped; infighting, stagnation of thought and action were sending the team into a downard spiral, and finally... the loony folks at the BCCI!! The team has shown a lot of courage and confidence... this is a good comeback.... hope they can keep up the good fights and of course, win more often than lose!

    By Blogger saum, at 10:46  

  • worma,
    Well spotte; I stand corrected Pieterson
    average: 73.09
    SR: 98.28

    Gotta wait for his average to come down from those insane heights


    shri,
    your comparison to Azhar's captaincy is flawed, because while Azhar did win quite a few matches, the winning percentage was very low.
    Just wondering, how wins would it take to give Dravid some props-- what if they win this series 6-1, beat RSA 4-1, and go on to beat the Lankans in the Test series. Will you still be saying there are too few swallows to make a summer?

    By Blogger Sahir, at 10:47  

  • worma,
    "to be precise...we haven't played this kind of buoyant one day cricket since the Pak tour ODI series... "

    Agreed

    By Blogger Sahir, at 10:48  

  • its a very solid start for a fairly new look team...

    By Blogger saum, at 10:49  

  • my question is (i did not see the match today) how did dravid do today when i guess under pressure a bit today...for the first time when sl was batting? we discussed one of the ways to look at as how he responds in a difficult situtation..not sure that was today but 298/4 sounds like sl played well...i think two other big issues are the ability to communicate as a captain to all and sundry and man management..on an off the field..remains to be seen how dravid does in those departments for a long period

    By Blogger indianfansrcrazy, at 10:49  

  • Dhoni got 10 Lakh Rs as MOM from RCA. I am impressed with the way RCA has sold this game. And yes this is kind of amount which should be given to a MOM instead of 20-40K. Good job by Modi and company.

    By Blogger Vick, at 10:50  

  • Although that Pak ODI tour was more than 20 months ago- that's a long time to play poor ODI cricket

    By Blogger Sahir, at 10:50  

  • sahir,

    i agree with shri and must say need to give time before passing any judgement (good or bad) on rd's captaincy..although can look for all the metrics even now..i think at least 2-3 series each at home and outside will be a good point

    By Blogger indianfansrcrazy, at 10:51  

  • The most striking feature during our batting was the excellent support that Shewag provided to Dhoni. Not that Shewag was slow, he still scored at more than a run per ball, BUT he did not try to go all out and match Dhoni stroke for stroke. Shewag's batting really embodied a true 'team' spirit. Keep it up...

    By Blogger saum, at 10:52  

  • sahir...my take...RD has done reasonably well in the few challenges he has faced so far (not counting his early days of filler captaincy). I am still waiting and watching..and making up my mind....and just like our honourable selectors, I would watch over 12 ODIs....but to be fair...a captain couldn't have had a better start that this (all those geniuses did not become so from match 1).

    And, adding a minor correction to your statement (directed towards sri) RD cannot lead Ind into beating SL in the test series...for he is not the test captain ;-))....and with that...I go out of here *asap*

    By Blogger worma, at 10:52  

  • indianfanscrazy,
    I agree that judgment cannot be passed this soon, but shri seems to be labeling the man as a passive captain already. I agree with the time will tell statement, but that does not mean it will take years to tell. 2 or 3 series is usually a good indicatior of where things are heading

    By Blogger Sahir, at 10:55  

  • I stand corrected for my presumptive statement about Dravid leading India to a test series victory Sri Lanka. However, my suspicion is that should India win both the ODI series, I expect the test captaincy to be handed over to Dravid, with Ganguly playing under him. Not stating whether I think it's right or wrong, for I don't want to get into that debate, but simply what I think will happen provided we win both ODI series in the leadup to the next Test series.

    By Blogger Sahir, at 10:59  

  • sahir agreed. with this kind of wins they cannot make dravid only odi captain doesnot make sense to have two centers of power.....they should make him captain for the entire season

    By Blogger tombaan, at 11:05  

  • i have an uncanny feeling too sahir that dravid will become the test captain and i think it makes sense. this probably should happen irrespective of our final results in the two odis. dravid needs time at the helm. the two captain theory does not work for the long term. i agree that ganguly will be in the test team as well...ironic as it may be. when you are building a team and choosing a leader you need to consider odi, tests at the same time and not only wc 2007. that is not a very comprehensive strategy for the future.

    By Blogger indianfansrcrazy, at 11:07  

  • Check this out - SL slips to #4 in ICC rankings after 3 straight losses. SA & Pak are #2 & #3... wow this series is testing the true mettle of ODI team #2 (former!)

    By Blogger saum, at 11:08  

  • oops here's the link http://www.icc-cricket.com/odi/

    By Blogger saum, at 11:08  

  • why isn't india moving up??

    By Blogger indianfansrcrazy, at 11:09  

  • well, we gained 7 points to move from 97 to 104.. but Eng is at 109... so still some way to go before we start moving up the rankings...

    By Blogger saum, at 11:11  

  • just to clarify, Eng was 109 before this series started.. and their points will change once the Eng-Pak series gets going...

    By Blogger saum, at 11:12  

  • Any updates on the weather at Pune for the next match?

    By Blogger Gardhabh, at 11:23  

  • Sahir, Shri,
    Some interesting comments all around.
    Firstly , what a win ! Yeee Haaw!!!

    As most people on this blog know, I am one who feels that SG still has a role in the ODI set up. But, we can safely say his ODI captaincy days are over, which for his sake may not be bad thing at all.. after he gets over his Ex-Prime Minister syndrome.
    Rahul Dravid has been a decent captain.. and also has had his fair share of luck in this series..(viz. an aggressive and fully fit SRT to throw at the opposition up front and IP swinging hte white ball and hitting the right length except today). SRT afterall is always the spiritual core of Team India). Coming back to SG, simply put, with the new supersub rule, SG is not necessarily an asset that is REQUIRED to be on the ODI field all the time. I still think he has a very useful role as a supersub once the rule changes to naming supersub AFTER coin toss. ANy day he'll bat better than JP in a ODI. We could pick a GOOD ODI bowler who also FIELDS very well over JPY and we may have a fine bunch of twelve players as the team. Each a match winner in his own right. Laxman is going to be hard done by and my concern is leaving him completely out of the Squad WILL be a mistake. World cup matches (esp. in the SUperEight phase) will have real HIGH QUALITY bowling. We need a Laxman to counter the bowling of the four-five teams that really matter and WC contenders. AUstralia, ENgland, Pakistan, SouthAfrica, and say a SL/NZ. Depending on form I would even pick VVS over SG as supersub. A Rao, or a Raina will never ever be good enough given the limited experience they will gain. By ICC cup next year we should have 16 players ready to go for World cup.

    The negative point for the team management with picking SG or VVS is they DO NOT provide flexibility to they team. They both will have to bat only at # 3. This is a big strike against both of them.

    By Blogger Prasad, at 11:28  

  • No Sachin Bashing this, just bashing kneejerk reaction of fans:

    Two matches, the god scores couple of gem knocks and predictably the god was restored the status that befits him. One failure. bah! that's an aberration.

    But to play devil's advocate a bit.....
    When chasing paltry target of less than 200 Sachin's in blazing glory and scores 4's and 6's.
    When chasing 300 runs, Sachin vanishes.

    If 2 matches is enough to sing peans then 1 match is enough to rubbish all claims.
    Alternatively, if crazy indian cricket fans realize that one's greatness is measured over time - and not over 2 matches - then they would stop deifying or dessicating someone over 1 or 2 games.

    Oh well, life will go on. We will either garland our cricketers or burn their effigy. In the mean time, worldcups will come and go and our dream of a WC will remain just that.

    By Blogger Raj Thambu, at 11:29  

  • btw, before we get too carried away and start comparing dhoni with gilchrist (bound to happen soon) i think there is a possibility that we cannot rule out that dhoni is suited more to subcontinent than outside. his technique and overall makeup as a free and hard hitting batsman is better for conditions at home. i just checked the average as well (altho too early) is 68.75 at home and 28.5 outside. can he face a quality attack and still do the same outside india will be the best proof. hoping he can do that.

    By Blogger indianfansrcrazy, at 11:32  

  • prasad, good points and i was considering the same before putting my line up for the indian team (see post before) altho did not consider the super sub only the top order. however, i think if sg 'truly' comes back to form he walks in to the odi team before any other batsman including vvs and the current top order as well. but, only remains to be seen..

    By Blogger indianfansrcrazy, at 11:39  

  • prasad,
    valid analysis, but we do have to wait for the rule change of naming the sub after the toss first

    By Blogger Sahir, at 11:43  

  • BTW, in the ODI rankings system, should India beat Sri Lanka 6-1 in this series, we will move in front of England. In fact, it is theoretically possible for India to move up to #2 after the RSA series if RSA continues to beat NZ and we beat RSA 4-1 or 5-0. This is because teams 2-6 are really bunched close together in the rankings.

    By Blogger Sahir, at 11:46  

  • prasad it is pitiable now ganguly fans want poor yadav to be dropped as they darenot pick on anyone else...yadav is a way better fielder and has not done bad..ganguly had his days in sun. i would try yadav till sa series to decide either way on him...the ganuly who could bat better than yadav is maybe two years back and not the current model....yadav it is over gangs even then i think joginder and vrvs need a break over old boss man gangs

    By Blogger tombaan, at 11:47  

  • I was one of those who thought this team was pretty fragile. Sachin gets out quickly, and the team folds. Its great to be proven wrong. We are getting liberated from the "savior" syndrome. Cheers

    By Blogger Vijay, at 11:50  

  • I would love to see India defeat SL and RSA convincingly and move up to #2 in the rankings. This would provide India an opportunity to try and beat Pakistan in the away test series, England in the hime test series, and for the first time become the undisputed #2 team in the world. Of course, that's all a long ways away. The old cliche holds very true-- one match at a time. On to the 4th ODI vs. Sri Lanka. Anybody know anything about the Pune wicket-- any domestic matches played on it recently; how did it fare?

    By Blogger Sahir, at 11:51  

  • Wonder when will it happen that even the most die-hard SG supporters realise that they are flogging a dead horse and stop raising his spectre in this blog and we can have some calm, level-headed discussion on Indian cricket.

    By Blogger Gardhabh, at 12:03  

  • indianfanscrazy,
    Completely agree about there being no comparison between Gilchrist and Dhoni yet. Slightly different reaosning though-- Gilchrist value has been that much more in Test cricket. Like Sehwag, he averages in the mid-50s with a strike rate around the mid-80s. Time and again he's won test matches and series for the Aussies when the top order had collapsed (the few times it does). A batsman's technique truly gets tested in Test cricket. I have no doubt Dhoni will be successful outside India in one-day cricket given the flat batting tracks produced for the shorter format the world over. However, his true test will come if and when he plays Test cricket for India outside the subcontinent. Boy, I hope he succeeds, not because it would add depth to the batting order, but because with him and Pathan combining in the lower middle order, India could afford to play a more balanced Test side consisting of 5 specialist bowlers. Could always have 3 seamers and 2 spinners.
    Possibilities of bowling attack in batting order:
    Pathan, VRV Singh, Kumble, Harbhajan,
    Sree Santh
    Balaji would also be in the mix once fit (certainly no mug with the bat himself)

    By Blogger Sahir, at 12:04  

  • TOMBAAN, Next, time, trying reading my post in its entirety. It might prevent a few silly replies. Are you telling me we cannot find a better batsman or a better bowler than JPY ? Then Indian cricket has really serious problems. VVS or SG will any day bat better than JPY. A Balaji or a ZAK (fielding remains a concern with ZAK) will anyday bowl better than JPY and have greater penetration and ability to take wickets. Its NOT just about being a Ganguly fan..its about finding a matchwinner at EVERY position in TEAM INDIA so we can win the world cup. We can win all the matches we want on silly featherbeds at home against an oppostion which is down at the moment. Can you for sure say that SG -without the burdens of captaincy- is done for as a ODI player ? Can you for sure say that VVS (if he does NOT have to field) has no role as a ODI batsman. Remember, the way to the world cup is THROUGH Austraia or England, or Pakistan. We better have MATCHWINNERS at EVERY position who can either take wickets or score against these oppositions.

    By Blogger Prasad, at 12:09  

  • BTW, anybody know if Mohammad Kaif is going to be required to prove his fitness by playing in Duleep Trophy game? Central Zone is playing West Zone on October 4-7; this would make him available for the 6th and 7th ODIs. Would really love to see him back in the team as soon as possible.

    By Blogger Sahir, at 12:10  

  • prasad,
    "We can win all the matches we want on silly featherbeds at home against an oppostion which is down at the moment."
    "Remember, the way to the world cup is THROUGH Austraia or England, or Pakistan."

    I find your earlier posts valid regarding the supersub, but as far as the 2 quotes above are concerned, I am not in complete agreement. The WC 2007 is going to be played on "silly featherbeds" in WI, like it or not. As far as going thorugh Australia, England, or Pakistan for the WC, remeber SL were being highly touted as a one-day team until this debacle. I still think they are a very good team, it's just that India's playing too well for them right now. Fortunes in one-day cricket can change quickly and honestly, any of the top 8 teams are very much capable of lifting the Cup in 07. The South African and New Zealand teams are definitely emerging as well as very good all-round units.

    By Blogger Sahir, at 12:17  

  • prasad..agreed..i mentioned before as well that 'if' sg is truly back into form, india cannot afford to keep out a proven matchwinner...as much as anyone else in the current team..but do realize politics will have a role to play and currently not in favor of sg. i seriously dont think vvs, rd and mk can be in one team anymore...simply because they cannot force the play all the time irrespective of how good they are..but as we know rd and mk will be in..so dont see vvs coming back in a hurry..

    By Blogger indianfansrcrazy, at 12:18  

  • SAHIR,
    "valid analysis, but we do have to wait for the rule change of naming the sub after the toss first "

    As I understood it , ALL the captains wanted the rule changes at the recnt ICC meet.

    By Blogger Prasad, at 12:20  

  • agree with sahir about fortunes in world cricket can change very very quickly and wc pretty much any top 7-8 teams can win...but, while i think india is playing very good cricket...i think we must admit sl is not playing like a top nation let alone their recent #2 tag. in fact, they are performing (batting top order other than today and all bowlers) like minnows

    By Blogger indianfansrcrazy, at 12:21  

  • YS - this guy is enjoying some hospitality. I would take VVS over YS anyday. Cannot play spin, cannot play pace...don't know why he is in the team.

    By Blogger Rajg, at 12:22  

  • BTW,
    Did anyone ever figure out why VVS did not play the last Duleep Trophy game? He was fit and not selected for the ODIs, so what was the reason?

    By Blogger Sahir, at 12:22  

  • On a side note,
    Any of you notice Gibbs and Boje no touring; these fools make it seem like they are being so accomodative by allowing interrogation in a neutral country, while the Indian police is being so unreasonable by not granting immunity. Why, pray tell, Messers Gibbs and Boje should you be allowed to commit a crime within Indian jurisdictional boundaries, and then have the right to be interrogated outside those boundaries or guaranteed immunity. Another two guys, that like Akhtar (and Flintoff with his raining bullets "autobiography"), ought to shut their traps-- they would be better served.

    By Blogger Sahir, at 12:27  

  • INDIANSFANSRCRAZY. I disagree with you about RD and MK being questionable inclusions in the team. Here's why : They are brilliant betn. wickets. MK is a natural and RD is good due to sheer hardwork and perseverance. They are needed from overs 20-40 along with YS. Question is how will RD cope if a delayed Powerplay is taken when he is in. WIll he consistently go over the top ? Recent history suggests he will.. and comfortably ! MK is a shoo-in really because he will save runs and may get you a brilliant runout. His strokes are limited though but he only seems to be improving every time out.

    By Blogger Prasad, at 12:27  

  • prasad, never said rd and mk being questionable inclusions at all...but, based on their game which is not necessarily to force the play, i think vvs (who cannot force as well) cannot come in to the team now

    By Blogger indianfansrcrazy, at 12:33  

  • who is ys btw??

    By Blogger indianfansrcrazy, at 12:36  

  • SAHIR, I agree with you that WI wickets may not be too dissimilar to indian wickets but the larger point I was trying to make is that we are going to face quality opposition attacks who know exactly how to use conditions in the Windies. We better proven, experienced matchwinners with a healthy dose of youthful exuberance (but not an experimental overdose).

    History will reveal that world cup winners have traditionally been teams with a more than generous sprinkling of OVER-THIRTY players (Sunny Gavaskar used to stress on their improtance, and affectionately refer to themselves (which included Vengsarkar, AMarnath, and a few others whose names escape me) as the OT's in his writings during the 1983-1985 world title runs we made)

    By Blogger Prasad, at 12:39  

  • back... looks like i missed quite a bit in the interim.. sahir.. not nulging in RD bashing.. But if my memory serves me right, SG in his initial forays as captain was way more aggressive than RD has shown so far.. Am using that bench mark as comparison. Any which way that RD shapes as captain, my best wishes are with him...

    As far as test captaincy is concerned, I do not think RD is an automatic choice.. Come to think of it, I would rather VVS lead the team out.. esp given that SG will hve to fight his way back into the team.. Unless some worthy in the BCCi has deemed the SL series to be SGs swan song

    By Blogger SHRI, at 12:40  

  • Oh, OK. Indiansfanscrazy.. You were saying that ALL three cannot be within the same team due to similar styles. Got it. My APologies.

    By Blogger Prasad, at 12:42  

  • YS=Yuvraj SIngh.

    Did anyone see his dismissal today ? How exactly did he get out ?

    By Blogger Prasad, at 12:43  

  • bowled.. playing the wrong line :))

    By Blogger SHRI, at 12:44  

  • SHRI,

    Ouch.

    By Blogger Prasad, at 12:56  

  • wormaa,
    that was a dramatic exit..'asap'. L.

    By Blogger CrickTip, at 12:59  

  • you cant use the benchmark of gangulys aggressiveness early on as a benchmark. may be dravid wil keep on being more agressive. he is more of a learner than SG. he would take cues from every game and improve on that. again thats a speculation on my part. but to speculate that RD isnt as aggressive as SG was at that time isn't a fair comparison. and what the heck we won 3 games in a row.
    lets wait and watch how RD evolves. i think GC and RD partnership would be great.

    By Blogger criclogic, at 13:02  

  • Yuvi needs to ply a lot more domestic cricket coz his approach to spin is suspect... Against pace he is fine... although he has failed a bit against the moving ball...

    wont be a bad idea to sit out Yuvi for a bit and play someone else.. just in case..

    By Blogger SHRI, at 13:02  

  • criclogic.. my point exactly.. it will be interesting to see how RD evolves a s captain...

    BTW have u noticed that we need major crisies to bring about change at the helm.. every single time...

    wonder when will it be that we will have defined the change of roles between captin and vice captain well in advance and get away from this musical chairs that is the Indian captaincy..

    By Blogger SHRI, at 13:05  

  • @Prasad

    Dishan bowled Yuvraj out. The same weakness against spin bowling. He played in the wrong line. Bowl was going to hit the off stump and he wanted to play in the leg side thinking that line is middle and leg. Yuvraj is also looking out of touch for long now. It is only his fielding which is better than Ganguly otherwise he would have been also out like him.

    By Blogger Shivam, at 13:23  

  • Prem,

    Can we have your comments please on the way Yuvraj is playing? He hasn't really performed for a long now. What can be done about it? Sehwag is also struggling but in his case he contributes time to time in some way or the other. But what about Yuvraj? At this moment Indians are winning but in crunch time Yuvraj and others would need to deliver.

    By Blogger Shivam, at 13:34  

  • yuvi did play a few good knocks in zim but clearly not consistent...i think it is flip flopped... sehwag needs to play better in odis (he is doing good in tests)...when is the last time he has been a matchwinner for india??

    By Blogger indianfansrcrazy, at 13:58  

  • Prasad
    ganguly on the basis of one match is not back in action. he has not done anything to justify his inclusion in one dayer or test for last two years. laxman i can understand but dont underestimate a decent performer like yadav. ...he has decent local records and a team man will get onfine wth current powers that be. gangs will add to the angst and troubles. look how the same has bounced back under dravid while it looked a third rate side with gangs in the seat....i for one would prefer a winning india than a losing one...gangs can go over to bangladesh for all i care

    By Blogger tombaan, at 14:05  

  • Thanks Shivam for the description.

    By Blogger Prasad, at 14:06  

  • tombaan...

    thats an extreme stance... I would rather that the selectors assess ganguly over the course of the next two months prior to the test series against SL. If his form and fitness are upto scratch then I would rather that he, along with GC and RD are taken aside and expectations set.
    As of today there is no clear picture on who the test captain will be.. and Sg for all his failings as an ODI captin is our winningest tst captain..
    On form and fitness, SG should be retained test captain, else told to hang up hi boots because its unfair to hi and to the team to keep this state of suspended animation.

    By Blogger SHRI, at 14:10  

  • All those who still wants SG in the team needs to remember this..

    They needs to go out and have some fresh air..

    Yuvi is OK.. dont worry.. He is in the team for bouncy pitches.. I guees He will do well in SA/WI/AUS/PAK..

    Cant play spin.. OK.. but teams like SA/ENG/WI does not have a decent spinner to trouble him.. and he is goot for pace bowling though..

    By Blogger Thanks Chappel, at 14:11  

  • I am very anxiously waiting for Gavaskar's article.. He was itching to see Rao with bat in his his hand..

    He got his Diwali wish fulfiled..

    Let us see whether he still goes after Rao or train his guns at Yuvi now as there is nothing else for him to talk about..

    I hope he doesnt think of SG a bowler.. in order to target JPY..

    By Blogger Thanks Chappel, at 14:14  

  • Chappel.. SG's presence or absence from the team will be determined by how he shapes up in domestic crickt.. and how the team progresses under the chappell-dravid combine..
    that said, dravid as an automatic choice for test captain is not set in stone.. and if SG does perform in domestic cricket, we will be daft to keep him out of the test side..

    By Blogger SHRI, at 14:15  

  • Ganguly betetr think about retirement.. may be challange Dalmiya for WB board presidency.. that will be a better thing to do.. Cricket.. Nahh.. he is done and over with.. atbest occasional filthy fifty will come to shore up avg in best of conditions and aginst poorest of attacks..

    Not worth bothering all of us..

    Calcuttans are after Pankaj Roy.. They think he should have resigned or walked out of selection meeting..

    "What Bengalis think today, world thinks tomorrow" :) jut a pun.. no regionalism intended..

    By Blogger Thanks Chappel, at 14:17  

  • Shri.. I guess we need to draft some young batsmen in the test team now.. SRT/RD/VVS.. all will go at the same time roughly.. so cant afford to have the enitre batting order almost brand new.. That will force us to rebuild for years.. Bats have to be a mix of experience and age... atleast 2-3 young guns are needed.. VS being one.. we need 2-3 more..

    In SRT/RD/VVS/SG.. if I have go about that.. I will drop SG right now.. to look to the future.. especially when SG comes back to the pavallion before I say "VVS LAXMAN"..

    By Blogger Thanks Chappel, at 14:21  

  • thanks chappel i agree. like i said gangs is past his expiry date. just need to go away...thanks but bye. steve waugh and mark taylor far better captains and better bats have gone gangs kaunse keth ke muli hai....he is no sachin

    By Blogger tombaan, at 14:34  

  • TOMBAAN,

    I am still not very sure you actually read my earlier posts. We are winning now NOT because its suddenly being led very well and only the captain was to blame all this while. As I mentioned in my post, the current Indian Team has the SRT of old who is dominating at the top of the innings, Sehwag seems to be sputtering back to life, we have dropped an out form batsman (SG), IP is swinging the white ball, and Bhajji is looking aggressive. Bhajji bowled poorly in Zimb. If I recall correctly IP struggled in the ODIs with the white ball, Bhajji bowled worse and AA continued at his preset level then and now. Matchwinners like Dhoni, IP and SRT will make any captain look like a genius. If one of the top three batsmen scores a BIG century or are involved in a close to 200-run partnership, more often than not the team will win. Check out the stats yourself. That's what the Indian toporder is doing now and so to your eyes they look amazing.

    However, I WILL accept that SG as a top order batsman failed just as did Sehwag and that really has hurt Team India in the lats year or so. No big hundreds from him or Sehwag and SRT was out. RD struggled in ZIM ODI series. Kaif is the only one who played well. YS did not succeed when required in the final and Dhoni got a rough decision. So, we never posted a 300+ total in the final. We were 150 odd for 1 in 25 odd overs at one stage. We ended up with 275. Compounding the problem was Nehra and IP did not bowl well in the final ODI against NZ allowing Astle and Fleming to get off to a flyer. Nehra who had bowled well through the ODI series flopped in the final. Agarkar, as I said was his usual mediocre self. Suit yourself , if you want to say its the captain who was the problem. My diagnosis then was a lack of matchwinning players and performances (including SG which I do blame him for). Then it was a Famine .. now its a Feast. Batting is a one-ball game. If Dhoni were to fall early today as he very might next time, do we have a batting matchwinner who would've won if for us today ? That is the central question. To guarantee that by WOrld cup '07, my suggestion is to PACK the team with MATCHWINNERS with either ball or bat.

    BTW, I have no illusions about it , if SG cannot win matches for India with his bat he does not deserve a place. But, I am sorry I think any day (accounting for form of course) SG and VVS will be a BATTING matchwinner over Rao, Raina, or JPY. Question for SG is his loss of form temporary or permanent ? If it is deemed permanent, He should not be selected.

    By Blogger Prasad, at 14:40  

  • TOMBAAN, i would not quibble with you about Steve Waugh, but Mark Taylor was a BAD ODI batsman who OPENED the innings and still averaged in the low thirties.

    Your previous point about SG causing angst within the team seems silly.
    When a towering player like SRT is within a team, there ARE NO EGOS.

    SRT has played under SG and RD. So, what would be SG's problem in playing for RD (which as you know he has done in the past). If RD feels insecure about his position as captain (which i am sure is NOT case) if SG is in the team, then we have a bigger problem in Indian cricket. Before, you jump up and down, let me reiterate that RD is doing a good job as captain and I support him fully as I support any indian captain for its the most difficult job in world cricket and it comes at tremendous personal and cricketing costs.

    By Blogger Prasad, at 14:55  

  • Prasad
    Gangulys form loss is permenant or temp...how much proof do you need for that....like 5 years is it? sg has sucked wind for over 2 years in all forms of game. if that is not loss of form what is it???? raina and rao are young lads and have not done bad it is not even a fair comparison but i would have anyday a raina than laxman and gangs who would run out and the worst movers. you dont need stars you need team men yadav to me is that a decent performer and a great team man. go look at his domestic record he is among top wicket takers and also a good performer with bat. dont write him off without giving adequate opportunity. yadav if i remember did turn in a decent performance when one was expected of him not so long ago...
    on recent performance rao, raina and yadav it is for me over slow moving laxman and wind sucking gangs...one duleep trophy century or century in zimbabwe doesnot mean gangs is back in form. There has been lot of decent duleep trophy performance including sriram, wasim etall so stop clamouring for gangs recall...he needs to wait his turn

    By Blogger tombaan, at 15:01  

  • This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

    By Blogger indianfansrcrazy, at 15:03  

  • thanks chappel, did vg bat too well today or looked good...not sure as did not see the match...sounds too early too either think of him as permanent or write him off without few more games...

    prasad: completely agree that we need more match winners than a new look team ...and i think it is completely unfair of tc and few other posters to completely write off sg and show no respect..this is why we dont deserve to be the number 1 team in the world and earn respect around the world for anything..even our supporters are as fickle minded and biased as our cricket board...the fair weather attitude and argument without logic or supporting evidence is of no use

    By Blogger indianfansrcrazy, at 15:06  

  • towering player like srt...what has that got to do with gangs...gangs doesnot see eye to eye with the current coach. You think it will be bygones with him and the coach so fast is it??? GC is doing a fine job and we dont need a ganguly to run amock with his dissive mentality. is not what GC said in his mail???? If i am a betting man i would bet it is tata for gangs one day career....i hope the selectors have balls to drop him from test too and also let him know which i think is fair.
    steve waugh thought he had in him to play one dayers but the selectors still dumped him. and in all probability he was in better form than ganguly is now....to me what we require is GC's ruthlessness to take tough decisions. gangs is a misfit and maybe needs to like chappell said try replacing dalmiya....

    By Blogger tombaan, at 15:07  

  • indianfans....let us not be fickle and bring back chopra, venkatesh who all wanted to play....it is time to go for gangs and i felt this for more than ayear...he is past his expiry date
    one of the reason we are not no 1 team is for not taking touch decisions..if it was aussies gangs would have retired from one days long ago and even the test by now...

    By Blogger tombaan, at 15:10  

  • indianfansrcrazy,

    We are not number 1 because we respect too much.. tthe past performances.. AUS kicked Waughs/Slater/Gillespie/Martyn all.. and they were all better than SG all the time.. Gillespie.. one bad series gone.. Martyn was man of the series in India.. was avging 60+ just before ashes.. got couple of filthy decisions in Ashes.. out of the team..

    Thats why they are number one.. Not even one lapse will be tolerated if even an equivalent option is available..

    We tolerated SG for two full years.. results are for all to see.. Your matchwinner SG didnt win a single match after WC03.. Tell me even one he won for us.. same story is in test.. we were winning.. because we were playing in Subcontinent.. why.. Sehwag and RD were awsome in the his time.. Ganguly still wanst contributing.. Still we ended up drawing with PAK..and losing to AUS.. if your captain is batting badly.. strategies naturally turns defnsive.. and I would consider our test performance AVG.. not exciting.. because we just defeated SA at home.. In Calcutta.. when SA didnt have even a half decent spinner..

    By Blogger Thanks Chappel, at 15:13  

  • tombaan, with all due respect, yadav does not look to be a long term prospect..or even for wc 2007..the ideal team man he may be..if we are really looking for an all rounder we should not settle for mediocrity..going by gc's standards :)

    and i think i agree with one of your posts about gc and sg not seeing eye to eye...let us admit that will be the biggest reason and political it is for sg not being in the team and able to come back soon...cricketing it is not..although it should be...this can and possibly will continue to happen even if sg is fully back in form...you and i cannot determine that..just wish for or against it..as we know a fully in form sg is better as a match winner than most of the current indian team...

    By Blogger indianfansrcrazy, at 15:16  

  • By the way, no mention of Rao in Gavaskar's latest article.. biten the bullet I guess..

    Next he suggest, we have 5 batsman and Dhoni in test.. which I guess is a good idea.. with Pathan to back up.. it a long enough batting lineup.. specially in the subcontinent..

    By Blogger Thanks Chappel, at 15:19  

  • thanks chappel..i guess you are confusing the issue..my point is i dont think any of those guys (waugh, slater, gillespie, et al) were subject to this much unnecessary hatred and bias from their countrymen...we ecel in that dude..

    of course no thinks or wants sg to be back if he is out of form..

    By Blogger indianfansrcrazy, at 15:20  

  • I guess yadav pefectly fits the bill.. for WC 07.. He is a handy bowler with good line and length.. and slight movement on and off the pitch.. a decent bat and fielder.. so I guess, he is on the line of Ian Harvey.. and he is needed.. another fast pacey bowler in middle over certainly will go for more runs..

    Currenly we have no better option than him.. If we get a better one.. drop him.. and that holds tru even for SRT.. if you get 5 guys better than SRT, drop SRT..

    By Blogger Thanks Chappel, at 15:22  

  • My hatred(However I dont have any) has nothing to do with SG's non selection..

    He is just pissing me off for two years.. I cant take it anymore and venting it out here..

    To top it all, he was certainly laying politics to save his place in the team..
    All those effigy burners also think like Ganguly.. I am sure they are selling posters outside stadiums.. "We miss Ganguly".. tell me.. when Dhoni whas blasting.. who genuinely missed Ganguly..

    Now the pressure tectics on Pranav Roy.

    By Blogger Thanks Chappel, at 15:24  

  • This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

    By Blogger indianfansrcrazy, at 15:27  

  • a good line and length bowler may not be good enough against strong oppositions...and whatever i have seen so far (admit not much)..he looks average at best...but if he is really of the ian harvey mold will be a good option for india..

    By Blogger indianfansrcrazy, at 15:28  

  • Wrong again.. TOMBAAN.

    http://live.cricinfo.com/db/ARCHIVE/2004/OD_TOURNEYS/NWC/SCORECARDS/ENG_IND_NWC_ODI3_05SEP2004.html

    SG scored a 90 (in a total of 204) in England last year (September 2004) in the Natwest challenge and as it turned out was a match winning performance against Eng.

    I agree with you that his running between wickets sucks. But, do you think Raina can handle spinners. Do you think Rao can hit the long ball ? Can either of them face quality bowling like a VVS can do ? When they do, I would be more than happy for them to replace SG or VVS.

    Let me also ADD that Rao, JP and Raina SHOULD be given many more chances to see whether they can score big and are suitable replacements for SG or a VVS. We already know what SG and VVS can and cannot do when in full flow. What can these new guys do ? That should be the question the slectors should get the answers before they decide what squad to have for the WOrld cup.

    You seem to be a person who is all about instant gratification and very little about the Big Prize. I could not care less about beating SL or SAF. As far as i am concerned , get me the f**king world cup and give me a team which can get us there.

    By Blogger Prasad, at 15:28  

  • "Thanks Chappell".. sorry to burst your bubble...Check this out:
    http://live.cricinfo.com/db/ARCHIVE/2004/OD_TOURNEYS/NWC/SCORECARDS/ENG_IND_NWC_ODI3_05SEP2004.html

    By Blogger Prasad, at 15:34  

  • This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

    By Blogger indianfansrcrazy, at 15:34  

  • tc, seems like a personal vendetta against sg...dude, why why why? is it the personality or the persona? but. this is what my point is....it is a game and our players are only human...and usually the indian fans will either put the players on pedestal or under the bus...

    how long before you are pissed off by dravid..or some one else and the saga will go on...

    By Blogger indianfansrcrazy, at 15:35  

  • indianfansrcrazy,
    What has SG got to do with him.. I am never seen him in person and in all probablities, never will..

    Absolutely no transactions possible either..

    He just is a shit batsman these days.. and should pay the prive for it.. I am sure he is losing all his money .. ad thing.. who wants to see an SG anymore.. May be maggi noodles..

    However as far as Dravid is concerned.. He is batting well, captaining very well.. using his resources very well.. Team looks happy.. and all of ur happier with the bang bang bang.. we are seeing..

    And I am sure, he will never need to cling to his place.. He has the technique and temperament to back it up.. SG lacked both ..

    So in my opinion, He is very likely to deliver as a batsman.. As a captain, He is.. if he doesnt, we move on..

    If he doesnt deliver as batsman.. just in case we still should move on and get someone new.. however I dont see that happening for 3 years atleast.. He is extremely fit.

    I dont think he will play politics with the young guys.. I expect him to know hsi day.. Incase he doesnt understand his value down the line and take lessons from SG in playing politics, then so what.. screw him.. He is paid performer.. Have to do the job well.

    By Blogger Thanks Chappel, at 15:41  

  • "THANKS CHAPPELL". Before you reply to me read all my posts to TOMBAAN.. I am sure your questions will be answered.

    As Indianfansrcrazy said to you "how long before you are pissed of by dravid..or some one else and the saga will go on,,,".

    I am sure you are a very nice person.. TC.. but your posts certainly give the impression that you have some serious emotional issues.

    I know of some people who would throw away even their closest relatives once their use to them is questionable. But, I am sure you are not like that.

    By Blogger Prasad, at 15:42  

  • prasad.. comon.. Dont feel happy with your statistics.. All the 20-25 that have played for us in last 3 years.. had one or two days.. Do you mean to say all of them should be in the team.. we wil have to field 20 in that case.. I can show you many scorecards.. for AA/ZK/AN/AK

    probaly even Rohan G.. surely for Badani/R.Powar/Karthik(both of them).. where they played well though were not the man of the match..

    By Blogger Thanks Chappel, at 15:44  

  • SG scored a 90 (in a total of 204) in England last year (September 2004) in the Natwest challenge and as it turned out was a match winning performance against Eng. MoM: SC Ganguly.



    You like TOMBAAN, seem to be a person who is all about instant gratification and very little about the Big Prize. I could not care less about beating SL or SAF. As far as i am concerned , get me the f**king world cup and give me a team which can get us there.

    Your mercenary solutions to problems (ie. dropping anyone who fails in rapid succession) will never win us a world cup, IMO.

    Let me also ADD that Rao, JP and Raina SHOULD be given many more chances to see whether they can score big and are suitable replacements for SG or a VVS. We already know what SG and VVS can and cannot do when in full flow. What can these new guys do ? That should be the question the slectors should get the answers before they decide what squad to have for the WOrld cup.

    By Blogger Prasad, at 15:56  

  • Prasad,

    Just to tell you something..

    I will support my siblings and friends and relatives in most scenarios unless they turn into criminals in my eyes(forget the legal stuff).. through thick and thin.. and I do

    I wont support a member of my team if he does not do anything and get salaries and try to lick ass to save his/her job all the time.. because he/she gets paid like me and their politics means.. difficult days for me.. so better get them fired before the whole team goes up in flames.. thats in professional life..

    Now about sportsmen, I have no lifelong attachments.. Yes admire a lot of them.. provided they stood upto my expectations.. unfortunately a bit on the higher side.. But if I admire Akram/McGrath/Gilly/Warne/Viv/SRT/Rhodes/Jayasurya/Slater/Waughs/Ponting .. whats wrong with it..

    By Blogger Thanks Chappel, at 15:56  

  • "TC"

    SG scored a 90 (in a total of 204) in England last year (September 2004) in the Natwest challenge and as it turned out was a match winning performance against Eng. MoM: SC Ganguly.



    You like TOMBAAN, seem to be a person who is all about instant gratification and very little about the Big Prize. I could not care less about beating SL or SAF. As far as i am concerned , get me the f**king world cup and give me a team which can get us there.

    Your mercenary solutions to problems (ie. dropping anyone who fails in rapid succession) will never win us a world cup, IMO.

    Let me also ADD that Rao, JP and Raina SHOULD be given many more chances to see whether they can score big and are suitable replacements for SG or a VVS. We already know what SG and VVS can and cannot do when in full flow. What can these new guys do ? That should be the question the slectors should get the answers before they decide what squad to have for the WOrld cup.

    Let just agree to disagree.. and I am just happy that Indian cricket selectors are not as shortsighted as you seem to be.

    By Blogger Prasad, at 15:57  

  • Common Prasad.. if you think SG is gonna be THE player to win you matches in world cup against good oppositions.. then I accept You are farsighted which I am not.. I hope selectors are shortsigheted though..

    By Blogger Thanks Chappel, at 15:59  

  • tc, come on now...you are not naive enough to think that politics and indian cricket don't mesh well..do you??..but, can you really show one instance in indian cricket where the captain has not been either been the victim or has victimised someone? but, the divisive charges against ganguly are also politically motivated..why?? because this is one captain against whom there had been no such charges other than gc after 5 yrs of captaincy and esp when things got out of hand (read gc's control)..also, sg is the only captain in history of indian cricket who actually got rid of stupid politics in indian cricket (like regionalism, beating around the bush regarding main issues about the sport) and took the administration and the rest head on..r'ber, we indians dont usually like a straight and tough talking, confident leader unless the leader also seems to be a nice and decent boy..that's what mom said..isn't it??..we need to value what we have before focusing on what we dont..

    and come on now...same standards are definitely not being applied across the board by gc...all rd can do (which sg will not do) is nod and let gc lead..not saying that is bad if we win..but makes you wonder who the real leader of the team is..one strong req. from a captain

    By Blogger indianfansrcrazy, at 16:04  

  • "TC" As I said, you have a view point which is radical and will never be mainstream or practical. I do not mean to offend you or hurt your feelings, but they seem a little immature and not very well thought out. However, its your opinion and I respect that. I am just happy that Indian cricket selectors are not as shortsighted. Now, before you write to me saying that I am an out and out SG supporter and blind to his failures.. please read my earlier posts. ALos, its silly to believe that SG is the only politician in the team. The BIGGEST is GC. He is way too smart to get caught, that's all. GC trapped SG and SG fell for it. All "credit" to GC for acheiving that. ANyway that's history.

    By Blogger Prasad, at 16:06  

  • "TC said: "I hope selectors are shortsigheted though.. "

    Are you serious, TC ?

    By Blogger Prasad, at 16:09  

  • You've got to be joking.

    By Blogger Prasad, at 16:10  

  • prasad, tc was joking mate..he is pulling a fast one on you

    By Blogger indianfansrcrazy, at 16:11  

  • so prasad is ganguly in form batsmen answer in yes or no????

    By Blogger tombaan, at 16:14  

  • BTW, TC, your comparisons to how Aussies get rid of Waugh, Bevan etc. and move on is not valid for Indian cricket . Because, we do not have players like Clarke, Hussey, Katich, Hayden who are totally ready to play AND perform consistently at the highest level right away. PP, Badani, RohanG, Ramesh, Martin, Sodhi, Bangar, and so many others come to mind..I have lost count really. Indian players take a long long time to bloom and give results. RD sucked at ODIs till 2002. SOme more cases in point, MK, YS and VS who still average in the low thirties after a 100 ODIS.

    By Blogger Prasad, at 16:16  

  • tc, it is also completely incorrect to say ganguly lacked technique and temperament..you cannot last in intl cricket without either..some has more and some less..but, what he has alot more than anyone else is guts..you need a lot of that and more to survive, lead and do well against the backdrop of indian cricket..big big challenge it is..

    also it is pure nonsense to think sg was continually victimizing youngsters...there are all facts pointing otherwise..i think everyone in the indian team will vouch for that..

    and btw, it includes rd as well..when he was not an automatic selection in the indian team..it was sg who devised the keeper/batsman role..so much for your playing politics theory..

    By Blogger indianfansrcrazy, at 16:21  

  • Yes, He was DEFINITELY out of form and may still be out of form at the international level.. we dont know the answer to that. I am not including his recent Duleep trophy match and the Zim test matches 'coz remember, you only said, they do not count they are JUST ZIM and JUST DT. However, Tombaan if he fails in the next DT game.. I am sure you will jump and down saying.. see he is out of form and so does not merit a place. However, if he scores some runs in that match.. then I am sure it will again not count in your book.

    By Blogger Prasad, at 16:24  

  • Mat Runs HS BatAv 100 50 W BB BowlAv 5w Ct t

    2005/2006 5 77 31 15.40 0 0 0 - - 0 2 0
    2005 3 79 51 39.50 0 1 0 - - 0 0 0
    2004/2005 9 178 55 19.77 0 1 0 - - 0 2 0
    2004 13 480 90 40.00 0 5 0 - - 0 6 0
    2003/2004 16 412 82 27.46 0 1 6 3/41 39.50 0 5 0


    this is gangs by season so judge for yourself is he in form......

    By Blogger tombaan, at 16:24  

  • over the 46 games he has played as listed above his avg is 26 that is not excluding 50s against kenya zimbabwe and what not. not a single hundred in over 2 years....i am not sure what your yardstick is. one duleep trophy hundred doesnot make up for the inadequacy for over 2 years.....

    By Blogger tombaan, at 16:27  

  • indiansfansrcrazy,
    TOMBAAN and TC have heard all your arguments before or at least versions of it...but they have a tunnel vision about things and, IMO, have a very short view. Its just this silly notion that Ganguly is ALL bad.. and GC is ALL good.. and RD is now the king of the hill. Whereas the answer lies somewhere in the middle.

    By Blogger Prasad, at 16:29  

  • BTW, TOMBAAN, SG himself has said that he has not scored hundreds in the last so many games and the crticism of his performance and his modes of dismissal is fair. Isn't that why he finds himself dropped ? SO, what's the problem ?

    By Blogger Prasad, at 16:33  

  • he is dropped that is good....a bold decision taken too late..should have atleast at year ago.
    He has to play atleast some time in the local games to prove he is back. to me his one hundred doesnot cut it...he has to compete based on current performance against rainas raos and yadavs...what he did years ago shouldnot be used to judge his comeback. remember amarnath...ganguly should go through same rut and if there is vacancy should be considered. not just drop rao or raina or yadav because they are raos or rainas. rao has an average of 50s in national tournament and needs to get a fair shot so does anyone else selected

    By Blogger tombaan, at 16:36  

  • TOMBAAN. That's enough ..I am burnt out on SG and VVS. If they are really good enough, they'll play and if not, they won't...there's no big emotion attached it.
    I want us to have the best chance to win the WC, that's all
    BTW, In many of my previous posts I have written that I agree with Kiran More and co. re: selection of team for ODIs 3-5. I did not have a problem with it because they seem to have a sound rationale for it. As long as the selectors are sensible and far-sighted (unlike you and TC) and know what they are doing (and it seems like they do), Team India for WC'07 will work out fine.

    By Blogger Prasad, at 16:40  

  • true as long as they are sensible like they are in recent past....gangs would be working his way back and no elevator rides for him

    By Blogger tombaan, at 16:41  

  • TOMBAAN
    You said..."rao has an average of 50s in national tournament and needs to get a fair shot so does anyone else selected ".

    If you had bothered to read my posts today.. that's exactly what I said.. without all your negativity about SG associated with it. Same applies to Raina and JP.

    By Blogger Prasad, at 16:43  

  • tombaan, statistics, statistics and lies..dude, sg's worst years (last two) shows 28...steve waugh's career was 32 (altho i know sg is top of the order and steve was not before you get excited)...not sure that proves too much as stats can be sliced and diced based on you what you want to prove really..but, obviously even by sg's admissions he has been out of form..and to be fair he is not in the team..the question is if he is back in form..can he come back to the team or politics will keep him out..because he is not really that old that he needs to retire

    By Blogger indianfansrcrazy, at 16:47  

  • i think he should comeback if he is back in form...but no elevator rides and he should perform like everyone else that means fitness and all the things that go with that,...he cannot do what he did during wrights regime.....he zaheer and nehra were some of the offenders and that shouldnot work

    By Blogger tombaan, at 16:50  

  • Some one who has scored 10K runs in ODI's will always get an elevator ride'coz they have a record already. Selectors, unlike you, know the value and difficulty of getting international runs and keep a perspective about it. If you have noticed Jayasuriya averages 32 after 340 matches. They still open with him. Why? Because on his day he will win you a match. He's sucking wind right now but SL will move gingerly in his case. Coz' people with a record always take the elevator up in any country..except australia. Thats why our slectors have reposed faith in VS, YS, and MK though they all average in the low thirties after more than a hundred games. Similarly they will keep giving Venu Rao ODI chances though he averages ..what ..18 after 9 matches. Has not exactly set the world alight has he ?

    By Blogger Prasad, at 16:53  

  • BTW cricket is a game of stats more than anyother game maybe baseball has more...so stats will always be there to decide performance....along with other factors but numbers do matter

    By Blogger tombaan, at 16:53  

  • ofcourse stats will always be there..the question is who is interpreting it to prove what theory..

    By Blogger indianfansrcrazy, at 16:56  

  • Rest of your cockamamie theories about not doing his fitness schedules and playing politics are JUST that. Theories. Its sad that you have to rely on such negativity and hearsays to make your point. Chalo boss, enough of this.. there's no point discussing this with you any further. You will find many people on ihateganguly.com who would lap up every word that you write.

    By Blogger Prasad, at 16:57  

  • TOMBAAN, You love stats right. Here are some.
    Recent captains ODI averages: Taylor 32; Ponting 42; Waugh 33; Hussain 30; Vaughan 28; Attapatu 38; Jayasuriya; 32; Smith 40; Fleming 32; Inzy 40; Ganguly 41.

    By Blogger Prasad, at 17:00  

  • and to add to prasad's stats...here is a look at sg's stats while he was captain for last 5 yrs:

    153 5418 144 39.26 13 31 49 5/34 37.87 1 61 0

    avg: 39.26...even after comparing to the career averages of most of the guys above..

    as i said..stats,stats and lies

    By Blogger indianfansrcrazy, at 17:33  

  • prasad prasad...it is tough getting across to you. you were one of the guys who was all upset at dropping of gangs..now you are bringing up career stats which i never denied. but gangs is out of form and should have been kicked out long back...he continued cause he was a captain...that is it. on current form he doesnot deserve a spot in the team. wright and chappell were not comfortable with his work ethics....he is not good fielder or runner and not getting younger. he needs to prove himself
    as for india fan
    stats is lies depends how you present them...current numbers are not good for him to get in that is all i am talking about.
    you know kambli has a very good average but we dropped him...he deserved to...so did gangs. i rest my case

    By Blogger tombaan, at 18:03  

  • This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

    By Blogger indianfansrcrazy, at 18:26  

  • but tombaan: the question is if he comes back to form will you support or not his entry back to the team..otherwise, you are missing the point and repeating yourself

    By Blogger indianfansrcrazy, at 18:28  

  • We all know SG is a minnow basher.. Let him play domestic.. Play him as player in Test team against SL.. if he looks like hitting form and capable of attacking in ODI, and at the same time Rao/Raina/Yuvi/GG combo fails.. bring back him.. lots of ifs.. so I am not optimistic.. Let us see his attitude also..

    By Blogger Thanks Chappel, at 19:24  

  • well, we know you are a sg basher..so your comments..tsk tsk..will not count..only kidding :)

    in fact i think we should wait even 2-3 series even if he is back in form..but i dont think there are too many ifs..if he is back in form..he is simply better than the rest..rao/raina/gg will not get a chance when mk comes back..

    but, again if sg is playing like old (must be a condition) he will walk in even before the current top order..other than srt

    By Blogger indianfansrcrazy, at 20:00  

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