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Sight Screen

Monday, November 07, 2005

Morning musings

Between them, Worma and Ruchir appear to have coralled the day's stories pretty comprehensively -- which actually makes me cheer; coz I woke up this morning and found I have to be in DC later this evening, for a one day trip, back or no back -- couple of Congressmen to meet, for a story.
Meanwhile, my two bits on an issue Worma has already discussed here -- the so-called 'dropping' of Venu Rao and JP Yadav. As Worma points out, not sure why so many eyebrows are being raised in so many different quarters -- the selection is surely logical? We have two more dead rubbers (and that has to count as a tremendous luxury -- when last were we in a position, ahead of an important ODI series, this one against South Africa) to experiment with personnel and fine tune the team and its strategies?
Picking VRVS has to be one of the most forward-looking selections the committee has produced in what is turning out to be a season of experimentation. The lad, judging by all reports, is about bowling as fast as he possibly can; he is young, he has built up a good head of steam -- seems the perfect time to give him a go.
Those who have seen him bowl say while raw pace -- and, interestingly, a determined nature that seems him put in even more effort when things are not going well -- are his pluses, a minus is his lack of serviceable swing and seam. If that is the case -- hopefully, we should get a first look at him in the next ODI and can make up our own minds -- this is a good time for him to come in, and learn the lessons of control and variation under the eye of the coach, and his peers in the Indian seam lineup.
There seems to be some ongoing angst -- and critical comment, from the likes of Arjuna Ranatunga -- over the fact that we lost the 5th ODI, halting a winning run; teams like Australia, someone was pointing out, don't let up when the going is good. IMHO, though, we are not in the position yet of being a set team, with a settled lineup and identified, tried and tested bench strength. Seems to me the priority for now needs to be to test the younger players in the heat of competition, get a good feel not only of how they play, but also how their nerve holds -- for instance, the loss yesterday was IMHO balanced by the discovery that Gautam Gambhir has the ability, and the nerve, to do the job in the opener's slot.
Given that, I'd tend to discount the Ranatungas of this world, and keep the faith -- if, before we pick for the SA series, we have identified the best 11 players to do the job plus four, five other players who can step into the side seamlessly in the event of loss of form/injury, these dead rubbers will have proved immensely valuable, wouldn't you say?
On a personal note -- will be off the map till tomorrow evening; am hoping though to return from DC in time for the game.

257 Comments:

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    By Blogger Steffany, at 11:58  

  • Prem hobnobbing with senators! Any lowdown on what is it about?

    By Blogger Gardhabh, at 12:09  

  • Everybody talks abt exclusion of rao/yadav. But no one talks about retaining murali karthik. IMO he is the crapest bowler under the sun. He cant get wickets. Nor can he control the flow of runs. He is a pathetic batter as well. (I know he has a terrific domestic batting record).
    I have seen people rating him higher vettori. He is not even 1% of vettori and will never get to that level

    By Blogger idli vade, at 12:25  

  • gardhabh: Routine, mate. Sen Edwards is doing to India next week. There is lots of behind the scenes action on the Indo-US agreements of July 18, esp the nuke component -- you get a better sense of what is going on in face to face meetings. And I need to meet Bobby Jindal to get some insight into a story we are working on.
    Nothing out of the way/unusual, really; such trips happen all the time, just that this particular one catches me at a point when I am not really mobile :-)

    By Blogger Prem Panicker, at 12:26  

  • yeah, sure...I am happy with the line of thinking going on....GG's potential on display was surely enough to offset a game we lost in a fighting manner. Even RP and Santh, from what we saw, were good enough to explore further. Fans should realise that 'experimentation' means 'less chances of winning'....and make up their mind that they cant have their chapati and eat it too :-)

    By Blogger worma, at 12:27  

  • hithere: I believe that to an extent, Murali's real potential was ruined by a team management that had little or no faith in him when he was bowling at his best. Bajji and Murali were both academy inmates at the same time -- one went on to become a permanent member, the other has spent more time out of the team than in it. That said, I'd think at this point in time, he has unfortunately lost the edge he used to have -- I'd expect to see Chawla make it to the team pretty soon; of the youngsters, he seems to be the most promising.

    By Blogger Prem Panicker, at 12:30  

  • Thsi morning, was listening to NPR, Nuke exemption to India by Prez is going to be issue in Senate and Congress. They also talked about Natwar case..oil-for-food scandal...luckily Volcker is not in India...otherwise...he would have met an accident.

    By Blogger Rajg, at 12:30  

  • worma
    yes i agree with u. however im a bit worried that both rp and ss didnt really ever threaten to pick a wicket with a good ball - i mean it was all trying trying to build pressure and then force the batsmen into an error - maybe this is not the right pitch to judge of course - ahmedabad is a deathbed for fast bowlers - but in the challenger i had seen ss swing the ball both ways and really i find that conspicuously missing here

    By Blogger GK, at 12:31  

  • worma: :-) Right. Actually, I'd love to see a largely experimental lineup in the next game as well (would love to see VRV included in the lineup and given his head, for starters) -- and that done, for India to go back to what it believes its best starting lineup is, for the final game, and go flat out to win, not for the numbers but to get into that mood again, ahead of SA.

    By Blogger Prem Panicker, at 12:32  

  • yep....good thought Prem. So probably get in VRV in place of AA, and Kaif in place of Raina (or even RD...don't think he needs to do much more, plus that hamstring pull). And yes, go full head into the last match with what we intend to field for SA....did you notice that SA did not pick up Gibbs and Boje for the last two ODIs against NZ...because those two were not going to tour India...so they decide to play 'as a team' with the group which was going to take up their next challenge.

    gk: in their opening spell RP and Santh were good. RP even induced that nick of Sangakkara, remember? GG dropped that one. Santh also had a good first spell...his bounce was seen to be believed....haven't seen any Indian bowler generate so much bounce on our dead pitches (Sri in his haydays maybe). And yes, you're right...SS was way better in challenger....that pitch and conditions were better man.

    By Blogger worma, at 12:37  

  • hi prem, glad that u r agreeing to me to some extent. however i dont agree with u :-) because did he ever have potential? he ever had.. anyways..
    btw i think u r the same prem who used to write in rediff. i must say u r a terrific journalist.of late i have not been seeing ur stuffs. so i was wondering where u went and googled u. found ur blog..
    cool stuffs...

    By Blogger idli vade, at 12:38  

  • gk: Was watching SS pretty closely for just the same reason; agree he did not move the ball much, but I actually was quite impressed with what I did see -- namely, that almost before he was done with his first over, he seemed to have sussed out what the pitch was doing and more importantly, not doing for him -- and he changed his bowling from the previous outing, didn't really try to move the ball around (would imho have been fatal -- if the pitch is not doing much, and you try variations, you invariably end up giving width and room for strokes; witness AA's final spell, when he was trying for breakthroughs and got tonked). Thought that was pretty mature of SS; would love to see him again on a seaming track.

    By Blogger Prem Panicker, at 12:41  

  • @worma
    yes - his bounce is what is most impressive - the key is that it is surprising boucne - however as the batsmen get used to him the effect will reduce - yes i want to see him develop as a long-term new-ball bowler for india for i think he has it the way he looks and runs in - but for that i hope he can maintain the swing and also bowl a good yorker - he did that too in the challengers !

    By Blogger GK, at 12:41  

  • hmm...must've missed his yorkers in the challenger...anyway, enough signs to want to see more of him....esp in those helpful conditions. Alas..our next trip out of home is some distance away...and that too to Pak, shouldn't find much help there....and even the next one to WI is not too promising

    By Blogger worma, at 12:44  

  • prem,
    yeah good point that - i somehow never liked the ahmedabad wicket - not for odis and DEFINITELY NOT FOR TESTS

    By Blogger GK, at 12:48  

  • worma: Kaif for RD was my thought too. Partly to rest his injury; partly because Raina needs a full game or two more. Also, if VS is to be the next captain at whatever stage, might help to try him out too, full scale, and get a feel for how he leads.

    hithere: No problems, mate; stuff like potential is highly subjective. Yes, I used to write on Rediff, thanks -- in fact, it was on Rediff I first cited MK's claims, after watching him bowl up close. At the time, and for a good while thereafter, I thought IMHO that he was a terrific attacking bowler. Trouble with the breed, though, is they are not as effective if given a defensive field and asked to check runs, and that unfortunately happened too often during his career. As of now, judging by how he has bowled thus far, he seems pretty much on the wane, which is a pity.

    By Blogger Prem Panicker, at 12:48  

  • This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

    By Blogger worma, at 12:48  

  • the speed meter shows 140 for santha and rudra prathapa. but they dont look that fast. even if its really 140, they dont look like troubling batsmen. rudra prathapa remeinds me of nathen bracken. i think balaji was very unlucky to miss out.

    By Blogger idli vade, at 12:49  

  • worma: Kaif for RD was my thought too. Partly to rest his injury; partly because Raina needs a full game or two more. Also, if VS is to be the next captain at whatever stage, might help to try him out too, full scale, and get a feel for how he leads.

    hithere: No problems, mate; stuff like potential is highly subjective. Yes, I used to write on Rediff, thanks -- in fact, it was on Rediff I first cited MK's claims, after watching him bowl up close. At the time, and for a good while thereafter, I thought IMHO that he was a terrific attacking bowler. Trouble with the breed, though, is they are not as effective if given a defensive field and asked to check runs, and that unfortunately happened too often during his career. As of now, judging by how he has bowled thus far, he seems pretty much on the wane, which is a pity.

    By Blogger Prem Panicker, at 12:49  

  • hmmm ... i think VS didnt do too much wrong in captaincy - it was just that he fell short of options and didnt have a big enuf score and unfavorable conditions

    i wud like to see VS come down the order next game just for a change and have SRT and GG to open

    By Blogger GK, at 12:51  

  • sorry for the double post, folks, donno how that happened :-)

    gk: Partly take your point about people getting used to his bounce; against that, the thing with a bowler like him is you never do really pick when the extra bounce will come along. he seems to have the knack of making it kick out of the blue -- think of the number of batsmen you've seen edging attempted cuts because they misjudged the bounce of a particular ball, and I'd think that can, as he learns to use it as a wicket taking delivery, yield great dividends for him

    By Blogger Prem Panicker, at 12:52  

  • prem: trying out VS as captain LOL :-)....you kidding?...forgetting that our 'main' captain is on trial himself ;-)...yeah I know I know....probably not on trial anymore..

    About Karthik...don't know think he bowled pretty well in ODI #1 when he and Bhajji cleaned them up? I think yesterday he was bowling in dew conditions...and obviously with a bit of defensive mindset...knowing we were not sitting on as many runs as we would have liked.

    And yes, probably because of his attacking nature, he's a better test prospect. His second last test match was Mumbai against Aus...did well, no? Lets wait for his next test chance before judging him.

    About his potential being wasted...well sometimes that happens...another problem was that his prime (as you mentioned) combined with bhajji's..and kumble was going great guns anyways...so what to do? Typical McGill scenario I would say?

    By Blogger worma, at 12:53  

  • prem
    yeah ... agarkar was like that in his early days .. surprisingly skiddy ... i still maintain he is an excellent bowler and i hope he will finally cement his place now

    By Blogger GK, at 12:54  

  • gk: I thought VS was a tad more orthodox in his captaincy (strange, that he is the more orthodox one and RD the more inventive one -- direct contrast to their batting styles). For instance, VS tended yesterday to give overlong spells to his bowlers; whereas a surprising facet of RD's captaincy has been the very short spells and rapid rotation he has used, to keep batsmen from settling down. I also thought if he was going to use AA to try for wickets, the best time would have been earlier on, before Dilshan and Arnold had really settled down. One other point -- he does not seem as singles-conscious as RD is; tends to push the fielders back that extra two three yards, that neither blocks big hits nor stops the short single; too many of them on offer yesterday, in stark contrast again to earlier games. But as you say, was the first time we saw him do the job, can't judge till he gets another chance or two.

    By Blogger Prem Panicker, at 12:55  

  • prem:
    yeah, we cant really judge VS. i was mad at ppl when they judged RD based on the job he did when SG was in one of his routines suspensions/"injuries" so ...

    By Blogger GK, at 12:59  

  • gk: You know, the funny part is I never thought badly of AA as a bowler; what I questioned was his temperament and mind. In fact, on the occasions when I have criticized him, I've always made the one point -- he is capable of being lethal when he focusses on the fuller line and length, given his ability to move the ball around; his trouble has always been that just when things begin to go well, he gets into this short-ball mood, seemingly in a misplaced sense of aggro, pitches too short (and often too wide) too often, and gets taken for runs big time. That said, any time he bowls the fuller line and length, he is potentially the most dangerous guy we have today.

    By Blogger Prem Panicker, at 13:01  

  • gk: *L* but then, the rush to judge RD had more to do with, how do I put this politely, extraneous considerations than cricketing curiosity. Anyways, that bit seems settled for now, so let it lie

    By Blogger Prem Panicker, at 13:02  

  • prem
    absolutely agree with you on AA. In fact I see him more likely to take wickets than even IP. I have been terribly surprised and disappointed by his lack of success over the years particularly in test match cricket. however dont u think he always got a raw deal and that nehra and zaheer were both given preferential treatment over him ??

    By Blogger GK, at 13:03  

  • Prem,

    To your point, it is too early to decide VS's captaincy style, the first time i saw dravid captain i thought he was way too "By the book"....not anymore :)

    By Blogger Realms, at 13:05  

  • worma: :-) I didn't think RD was on trial. And since VS has been installed VC, I'd think the management would want a feel for his handling abilities on the field, in full scale match situations.

    About MK, I am not so sure it was a McGill situation; even granting the Kumble factor, I think for a long while, we got seduced into this mindset that we would pick three seamers and only one spinner (mostly rotating between Bajji and Kumble). I thought in many of those games, we would have been better served with two spin two seam, rather than pack the side with three seamers two of whom were pretty identical in style. I think this was where Karthik missed out, really -- but as you say, happens often enough in Indian cricket, what to do? :-(

    By Blogger Prem Panicker, at 13:05  

  • Nice post Prem about VS on captaincy ..
    majority of my take from the last game, in a separate post i even thought we may have won the game if RD was captaining it.

    commenting on
    "he does not seem as singles-conscious as RD is "

    The fielders that were placed for stopping singles at times were slightly deep , i remember a couple of singles taken from the close_in fielders in later stages of game

    By Blogger Pankaj Tripathi, at 13:07  

  • AA is a enigma,

    On days when he gets his line and length he is a devastating bowler and on his off days is a lame duck waiting to be slaughtered.

    IMO it is lack of discipline and hence the inconsistency that would undo him and the team. If there is a way to do away with that inconsistency and we have a damn good bowler to fall back on. This is prolly the only series where he has been this effective right thoughout...of course there are two more matches to go.

    By Blogger Realms, at 13:07  

  • I have been reading the commemts and totally agree with Rajesh and others about Kaif...the guy is useless. Anybody who has one matchwinning (???) knock in a year should be out of the team.
    Comparing JP and Kaif is not fair. On one hand you have a player who has literaly got 100 chances to prove and on the other had, JP is always on trail without any opportunity to prove his batting at a good number. Compare their records in first class and see. What you will also see is that JP is a sureshot 10 overs 'good' bowler. That itself should put him ahead of Kaif. Kaif may or may not be a little better ( maybe due to his international exposure) than JP in batting, but what about the 10 overs? Isn't that as important as batting?
    Kaif should not be in the team period. There are far far better batsman of 'real' class, not manufatutred ability.
    Examples...Badani, Gambhir...even Mongia.
    By the way to a lot of people Badani should not even be talked about with the likes of Mongia, Kaif, Yuvraj or Gambhir...he is actually in the class of the Dravids and Sehwags and Tendulkars. But he is one tragedy of Indian cricket. He is actally a 50+ (test) or 40+ (odi) avg batsman.
    Alas...

    By Blogger mau tor, at 13:09  

  • gk: donno, mate, I think rather that the likes of ZK and AN got their chances primarily because AA wouldn't nail his place down for keeps.

    realms: Oh, totally agree it is too soon to judge; is in fact why I think this is a good phase to let him take the team in his hands for a game or two, while we are playing with nothing to lose and everthing to gain. RD I figured would do interesting stuff because in the few chats I've had with him about captaincy, the points he made were precisely the sort of thing I thought would happen. For instance, a long time back, I remember him commenting that we too often made the mistake of thinking that if we had 250 or less on the board, we had to 'defend' it; his point was, anything under 250, any team could get if they set themselves to simply bat 50 overs out, so no point defending, was way better to pull the field right in, put catchers in place, tell the bowlers to go flat out even if that meant a four or three going, and look to pick wickets often. Was very kicked he made that point, was wondering if he had the will to implement it if and when he ever got the team. seems, judging by a few games in SL and now here, that he walks much of his talk

    By Blogger Prem Panicker, at 13:09  

  • prem, I mentioned MK missing out due to two 'better' spinners as test match scenario. Not in ODIs. Yes, I agree that in ODIs he 'sometimes' missed out because of our mindset to play 3 seamers (which itself, mind you, was a pretty good and innovative one at one point of time...and worked well for a while too....but towards later part was overdone a bit). And in ODIs he would often have played ahead of Kumble too...so yes, some missed chance there.

    By Blogger worma, at 13:15  

  • mau: Interesting you brought up Badani's name; that is another talent wasted, sort of like Jatin Paranjpe earlier -- I always thought Jatin had what it took to make the team, but in his peak, he got ignored (that he is Vasu's son doesn't help) and then he got injured and finally threw up his hands and went what the hell, this is not going to work for me. Badani thus far has stuck it out more, but time is running out for him too.

    By Blogger Prem Panicker, at 13:16  

  • To add to my comment on JP and Kaif.
    Here my honest though. You have Kaif, Yuvraj,Zaheer and Agarkar in your team and I can almost garantee the WC is not coming home.
    The biggest problem is that Agarkar is NOW performing. Setting himself up to screw up in the WC..say a semi final or a Final...he needs a bigger stage, doesn't he?The man's a joker. A million matches with more than 5 runs an over,hundred ducks...he irritates me no end.

    By Blogger mau tor, at 13:16  

  • prem
    but consider this - natwest series 2002 - agarkar and zaheer bowl beautifully in the first few games, india reach final, nehra is picked for a game or so does ok - he is put in the final both zaheer and nehra flop in the final, luckily we win it courtesty YS and MK

    zimbabwe tri-series 2001 - again agarkar zaheer and nehra bowl well first 2 games, then AA is rested, mohanty and harvinder come in after a long gap - mohanty bowls one dream spell, he is in the finals - all 3 zaheer, nehra and mohanty flop miserably in the final we lose.

    aus 2004 - agarkar has just played a crucial role in the test at adelaide, taken a 6-wkt haul in the opening odi too, when nehra has done practically nothing - in the first final agarkar is slightly off-color and bang he is dropped for the second - we lose miserably

    every time nehra or zaheer come back from injury they get an automatic entry into the team but agarkar after one poor game has to sit out. why even now, after his great show at pune, some ppl are criticising him for his "relatively ordinary" effort at ahmedabad.

    and consider how many matches he has won for us in his first year - the final against sri lanka at colombo in 1998 when sachin and Sg put on 250 is the prime exapmle - SL needed 40 runs from 8 overs 6 wkts in hand - agarkar takes the crucial wkts of jaya, desilve, ranatunga etc in that inns !!

    By Blogger GK, at 13:16  

  • Prem..sad about Badani..isn't it.
    Jatin was good, I have played with him for 5/6 years. The good thing about him was he had a very good cricketing brain.( What with being Vasu's son, and being is constant company of Sunny and more so Shastri. Infact he used to copy Shastri a lot. But yes, I agree, he was very talented. When people talk about the Kaif's and Utappa's at under 19 level, Jatin was even better than them. I remember his hundred aganist Pak..

    By Blogger mau tor, at 13:20  

  • gk: Boss, not disputing his ability. It is precisely because he is a match winner that I get so pissed off when he then goes and bowls that stupid short length. I mean, remember when Chandra used to play? He would win one match, then be shocking ordinary in three -- but at the time, we could carry him because we had Bedi and Pras and often Venkat -- plus blokes like Solkar and Durrani and Abid and others, so if Chandra was having an off day, we could just hide him and let the others do the work. Unfortunately, these days you can't do that, carry a player -- which is why AA with his talent needs to make it work two games out of three. I don't expect him to win every match he plays in, but I think if he gets his head screwed on right he has the potential to make a winning contribution in one out of four -- and would happily settle for him bowling tight lines in the other three.

    By Blogger Prem Panicker, at 13:24  

  • mau: precisely. and a brilliant fielder before brilliant fielding became fashionable. could never understand how come the bombay lobby never once pushed him seriously

    By Blogger Prem Panicker, at 13:25  

  • Makarand (or Hemant, I dont know) Waingankar on captaincy in India
    http://www.tssonnet.com/tss2845/stories/20051105000502400.htm

    and Vijay Lokpalli on Challengers

    http://www.tssonnet.com/tss2845/stories/20051105000502400.htm

    Both on sportsstaronnet.com

    Quite interesting..

    By Blogger Reverse Sweep, at 13:26  

  • Kaif for RD? That is so daftful thinkig, if they did that.

    Kaif is in for Rao in the X1 for 6th. (as we all know Rao has been dropped from XV; btw, he should not have been picked after what he showed what he is in SL and ZIM - irrespective of Challenger grafty knocks).

    One of RSD/SRT/VS could be rested; If both SRT and VS
    want to play, GG could slot in at #3(YS goes out).
    VRS is in for AA; IP in for Singh; Santh gets another chance. RPS could be the SS.

    Ideal XII:
    VS,GG,YS,RSD,MK,SKR,MSD,IKP,HS,VRS,SS,RPS(SS)

    If SRT wants/needs to play, either VS or GG plays
    at #3 and YS goes out. If RSD wants to rest his
    cramped hamstring YS stays.

    By Blogger Yacrik, at 13:26  

  • prem,
    yeah - but my point is how do u rate him in comparison with zaheer and nehra ?? i for one believe that nehra is the most overrated cricketer to have played for india in a long time. only recently he was beginning to come good but he is not only overrated, he is lazy, a day-dreamer and a pathetic fielder. zaheer was pretty good until 2004 but injuries, laziness and complacency have made him pretty futile - i always get pissed when these two are given preferential treatment over agarkar

    By Blogger GK, at 13:27  

  • the tragedy with badani is that again, thanks more to TN politics than anything else, no one ever really pushes him. i remember before SW's Aussies came here, meeting him and I discovered by the merest chance a notebook of his. Turned out, he had starting some three months previously, gotten hold of Aus cricket tapes against various teams, and had been watching over and over again, making notes on the batsmen and the bowlers. Among other things, he seemed to have figured out when McGrath was going to bowl the slower one, and also that sharp in-ducker of his; was in his notes and when I asked him if he wasn't maybe reaching a bit, showed me a couple of videos pointing to a perceptible (barely, but still there) change in approach and grip when McG bowled those deliveries. Point being, was very dedicated to learning and improving, had sufficient skill sets to make the grade. But since when did all that count, unless you were lucky to be part of the right 'camp'? In TN, he never was, just like Ramesh

    By Blogger Prem Panicker, at 13:29  

  • @gk:

    On AA: if anyone doubts his ability and contribution, you got to be suspicious of his cricketing acumen and judgement. AA is not debatable - he is unique.
    He is comparable to world's best. check his stats and
    his skills; he is the ONLY indian bowler right now who can move the ball both ways.

    By Blogger Yacrik, at 13:29  

  • prem,
    i too liked badani but the point is do you see a place for him NOW ? i dont to be honest

    By Blogger GK, at 13:30  

  • gk: nehra the fielder doesn't rate --he is venky prasad territory. as a bowler, i thought he had great potential -- if his various body parts could stand up under the strain of actually walking out onto the cricket field.

    with zaheer, the question has never been ability, so much as inclination. he seems to work hard only when he is axed from the team, and in his first game back; then he slacks all over again.

    By Blogger Prem Panicker, at 13:31  

  • prem,
    well thats fine - but if you put aside all external factors and simply compare cricketing skills in what order would you rate AN, ZK and AA ?

    By Blogger GK, at 13:33  

  • Badani lost out when he failed in SL in the opening slot.Probably unfairly. He is a great fielder too with some useful bowling when others are being tonked. I dont see him coming back. What he needs to do is, just keep at it, not giving up. TN just seems to throw up the likes of Shridharan Shriram, who in sipte of the chances he has got is neither here nor there

    By Blogger Reverse Sweep, at 13:35  

  • @gk:

    I think you got it right on Zaheer too;
    beginning of 2003 he gets injured in Aus and out.
    2004 season injured again midmatch/midseries.
    2005 looks injured/tired/jaded in the beginning.

    3 seasons and enough! 3 strikes and you are out.
    You can't have your strike bowler injured all the time.
    Unless Zaheer plays 2 years of good domestic cricket, he should not be back!

    By Blogger Yacrik, at 13:37  

  • I dont think we can bank on the Nehras who do well in one match, then get hammered in the next few and eventually break down. Dont want to play tests, field and run as if you are wearing sarees and then then put on and acting performance when the others cant save a four on your bad ball

    By Blogger Reverse Sweep, at 13:39  

  • While I would have like JPY in the team, but then have to admit the competetion is tough..

    Especially we have to keep droping couple of players every time we sit to select, even when we win.. just to keep the fire burning.. and it also make sure that discipline is upto the mark..

    JPY will be a very effective bowler in conditions where it swings a bit.. On these flat Indian pitches, I have seen the best of them getting hammered.. why just blame JPY.. SO well I will surely keep JPY in plans.. Unfortunately SLankans are goiung after him and on these falt pitches(Add dew factor), all of them are cannon fodder..

    Please note that, in all the matches I have seen in last few years where dew was a factor, team batting second has always won.. be in jublee match in Calcutta or any other one.. SO no need to cry on the last lost match..


    VRV Singh.. I guess his inclusion is very good for the team.. Even if he does not get to play, I want him to spend some time with seniors so that he can learn some "Principles of moving th ball" .. Once he does that, He is going to be the punch that Indian needs to knock out teams outside subcontinent..

    He seems to have brain.. His batting seems to be good enough for a tailender.. All this makes me optimistic..

    By Blogger Thanks Chappel, at 13:39  

  • Some guys are reading TOI with passion..
    And they seem to be missing Zaheer..

    I dont need to post stats here.. but I have seen him bowling for last many years..

    Anybody who goes after him succeeds.. No denying that..

    Thats why he suck at intl level.. On the top of that he is a pathetic fielder and a pussy batsman.. When there is nothing to lose or nothing to gain.. he loft the sixes.. but put a bit of uncertainity and he is a realy pussy batsman to say the least..

    To me he is sheer crap.. and never should be in any team.. be it ODI and test(and he hasnt done a f*** in test either.. you free to visit statsguru)..

    and why this concession for bad fielding in Tests.. Are runs invaluable there.. AN/ZK cant be in test team either..

    Dometic cricket.. (as well as whatever wickets he has got against minnows).. this is the reason for his success..

    Domestic batsman(and minnows) are awed by the "publicity" that he has.. because he is "Indian Spearhead.. and so on and so forth".. They seem to defend him and he turns deadly if batsmen are defending ball right under their nose .. and on the stumps.. I guess the day domestic batsmen forget his "So called greatness", they will screw him..

    Jadhav showed that in Challenger.. 4 classic boundaries in one over.. Common.. And people want ZK in the team..

    He bowls on batsman's pads.. often full.. a scared(incompetent) batsman see the ball coming to stumps.. defends.. often misses one out of ten. Zaheer looks as if he rocks..

    Good bats(which includes all top order bats of almost all the top 5-6 teams sans minnows), take a stride.. thump his half volleys to the point they chose.. he goes for plenty.. In order to hit ZK to boundaries, you dont need even good footwork.. Just a bit of audacity and capacity to read the line is enough..


    ZK is a disgrace to fast bowling.

    By Blogger Thanks Chappel, at 13:40  

  • good selection

    By Blogger tombaan, at 13:40  

  • Like Prem said, Zaheer only performs in the domestic matches when he is dropped. When he is back in the Indian team, its back to the same old story. How long can you watch your supposedly strike bowler being hammered by all and sundry. Who can forget his first over in WC2003

    By Blogger Reverse Sweep, at 13:41  

  • i do believe nehra has been given too much of a leeway because of that one WC 6-for against england - that was great but it was just a oneoff - why in the very next match he flopped miserably against pak !! it is good that GC has asked him to shape up or ship out - SG was very benevolent on him i think - for now he is not even playing duleep trophy - earlier he cud afford to not play domestic cricket and make a comeback now he cant do that - i do think we wont be seeing nehra for a very lonng tome now and i hope that is the case

    By Blogger GK, at 13:42  

  • gk: If you accept the codicil that all external factors merit consideration equally with cricket skills, then on skill sets alone I would list them in order as AA, AN, ZK -- and I'd put ZK in there only because I had to. Besides all the factors re ZK I mentioned, I've seen that bloke work on his fitness if you can call it that; in all honesty, I am fitter at 47 than he is at his age. Not because he has intrinsic problems, but because he is just too damned lazy, and for me, that is enough reason for the axe. I mean, if playing for India is not motivation enough to put in a couple of hours of gym time working on basic fitness, than bye bye bloke.

    By Blogger Prem Panicker, at 13:45  

  • With Zaheer Khan.. another problem is this..

    In a match of any significance.. His blood starts boiling and it takes over his brain.. He bowls as if he is on drugs..

    Come first over.. He will bowl towards the third slip.. Keepr will have to dive.. touch the ball.. Ball will go somewhere.. a wide + 2 byes..
    Now comes the correction in the line.. Another one .. way down the leg side.. And keeper fails.. 5 added to the score.. no ball yet added to the over..
    And the result of the match has laready been written on the wall.. no matter how hard you try.. Zaheer lost it for you..

    So guys, get over Zaheer.. let him pay. He is good at only domestic scene for 2 more years.. The batsman who are out to him often, arent worthy of selection either..

    By Blogger Thanks Chappel, at 13:46  

  • gk: Dont have a take on Badani *now*, but only because it has been three years since I've really watched him play and I don't have a good feel for how he is doing. I could extrapolate from domestic results, but I've always been reluctant to do that.

    By Blogger Prem Panicker, at 13:46  

  • I sincerely hope we have seen the last of popats like nehra and zaheer. Now if only the Sanths, VRVs, Rudraprataps can makes sure they dont go the Nehra, Zaheer way and if Agarkar can bowl fewer 4 balls..

    By Blogger Reverse Sweep, at 13:47  

  • Prem, we have seen the fast bowling reserves that we have in SS,RP,VRV et all and its great that India is churning up a battery of bowlers who can bowl at 90 miles an hour. What about the batting reserves? By what you have seen of VR,SR and the others are you impressed and do you think the batting is in good hands, cause dont forget that RD and SRT will probably retire at almost the same time ( same age) and those are mighty boots to fill. O yes, where the hell is Ambatti Rayudu??!!?

    By Blogger Harsha, at 13:47  

  • prem,
    thanks ... i quite honestly wanted that opinion from an expert - and an honest one !!

    it pretty much matches mine :-)

    By Blogger GK, at 13:48  

  • TC, touche`

    By Blogger Reverse Sweep, at 13:49  

  • Actually, of that lot -- ZK, AN, etc -- the one I'd like to see coming back -- form and more importantly fitness permitting -- is LB. His basic skill sets are interesting; when he is bowling at his best he is quite a handful, has the knack of picking wickets... pity he fell away for whatever reason. Two other guys I would love to see make it to the team is the leggie, Chawla, and that Bombay lad, Rohit Sharma, who they are talking of as a bit of a prodigy with the bat. actually would love some insight into those two from any of you guys who have watched them play

    By Blogger Prem Panicker, at 13:50  

  • Makarand (or Hemant, I dont know) Waingankar on captaincy in India
    http://www.tssonnet.com/tss2845/stories/20051105000502400.htm

    and Vijay Lokpalli on Challengers

    http://www.tssonnet.com/tss2845/stories/20051105000502400.htm

    Both on sportsstaronnet.com

    Quite interesting..

    By Blogger Reverse Sweep, at 13:52  

  • harsha: I am still kind of hesitant about Venu Rao, at least in the short form, but I really like what I've seen of Raina thus far. Amazing composure, for a 19 year old, that plus the fact that he plays authentic cricket shots, is good enough material to build on. If you add to it the fact that his fielding skills are world class, his pick is pretty much a no-brainer; would want to see him persisted with for a full season even at the risk of his failing now and again; I suspect at his age, and with his skills, he will learn fast enough. The rest of the batting, damned if I know, I really miss being able to go around watching some of these new lads play, to get a first hand feel of what they look like out there. Rayudu if he gets back into his groove would be a sure bet; Rohit Sharma is being talked up big time... not too sure who else we have.

    By Blogger Prem Panicker, at 13:53  

  • harsha: and on that not sure who else bit, do note, I mean it in the sense I haven't seen the younger lads

    By Blogger Prem Panicker, at 13:53  

  • Prem, who is Rohit Sharma?? Never heard of him to be honest. How old is he and which state does he play for? Going by your words, he is the one to watch out for in the future. Appreciate your insights.

    By Blogger Harsha, at 13:55  

  • gk: :-) I get queried over my anti-AA stance. I donno, never managed to convey the point that with some players, you hold them to a higher standard simply because they merit it; is why I get furious with AA-- especially when he gets all aggro and starts bouncing it around. His real skill is, when he pitches length, he moves the ball in the air, *and* off the seam -- add to it the fact that off length his ball skids rather than bounces, and that makes him the heck of a handful. Is precisely why I then get pissed off when he forgets all that and lands it on his toes.

    By Blogger Prem Panicker, at 13:56  

  • Prem apparently Balaji's action is being tampered with, leaving him confused. He seems to lost pace and also accuracy??

    By Blogger Reverse Sweep, at 13:56  

  • harsha: no no, dont go by what i said, i haven't seen him play but I am going by what I am told, that he is one to watch out for. bombay lad

    By Blogger Prem Panicker, at 13:56  

  • Prem, Rayudu is a disappointment so far. Last 2 yrs in Ranji, he didn't score a century. I saw hime live in Gymkhana Ground, he scored some 30-40 runs....did not appear like a big class batsman.
    Also, he got into a spat with Shivlal Yadav, transferred to Andhra. From South, Yadav is a powerful guy....don't think....AR will have a supporter in selection commtes.

    By Blogger Rajg, at 13:58  

  • Hopefully Rayadu will get a good team to represent when state associations follow Maharashtra to include players from other states/teams, much like the sports teams in the US.

    Then we can judge if he has it in him to do well for India.

    By Blogger Kannan, at 14:04  

  • Cheers Prem. As far as the test match batting line up goes, it is pretty much clear that SG wont be in the lineup ( Will be amazed if he is included in the test lineup considering the fact that he is not tought good enough to be in the ODI team) who do you think will get his spot. I was tempted to say YS but seeing his form of late, i dont think he is the answer just yet. MK is probably a good bet but it depends on how he fares in the remaining ODI after coming back from injury. Also do you think MSD will get a go before Karthik? I think the time is right to blood Dhoni into the test match side.

    By Blogger Harsha, at 14:05  

  • hi good morning,
    i think the did good job on selections. About JP i said earlier too he is allrounder but not kind og bat who will smack bowling once in while.he was ditto Bangar type and what i'm observing is GC looking for genuine match winners either with bat or bowl. Rao got quite enough chances and i guess he missed out coz he did played single big inning of them.
    For next two matches, i have followed cricket on both venues from long time. they are small and flat in nature and feeling for new pacers. thry will get stick but i guess still as always can leave impression.
    For YS,VS and MK these are two best chances to get back in form.
    i think we should also try SRT, GG to open and rest RD, play VS at 5, MK at 3 and YS and raina will have toss up for no 4 and 6.

    By Blogger MAHER, at 14:05  

  • Prem: Yesterday I posted this question towards end of the game. Yesterday, the batting looked so easy and the singles could not be stopped. Looked like batting practice.

    In such case - why is it impossible to stop the runs? Can't the captain do anything about it? I did not see VS trying anything new but changing bowlers in trying to get a wicket.

    By Blogger nilcritz, at 14:08  

  • rajg: I talked of Rayudu on the basis of what I saw of him about three years ago. I do appreciate he seems to have fallen away since -- and has been having problems, transfers, etc. My take is only this -- that if he gets to where he realizes the potential he showed then, he is a long term prospect for India. AGain, highly classy batsman, superlative fielder, bowls a bit as well.

    Guys, need to run... have to go home, pack, and head off to DC. I'll likely see you guys tomorrow night for the game, am hoping to make it back in time for it. Cheers all and adios for now; this has been fun

    By Blogger Prem Panicker, at 14:09  

  • ooops. i mean Rao did not made single big score.

    By Blogger MAHER, at 14:09  

  • Prem, have a safe trip. bye.

    By Blogger Rajg, at 14:11  

  • Maan,

    Quite some insights into badani's home work... Dunno about the politics behind the TN team but i would certainly not blame Ramesh's carrer turn to TN's politics. He was ganguly in laziness minus the leadership qualities. He was arrogant too..it all comes back to the question of attitude and he wouldnt have survived long in this team.

    By Blogger Realms, at 14:38  

  • Itna sannnnaata kyo hain Bhai...?

    AK Hangal in Sholay

    By Blogger santa_from_NJ, at 14:58  

  • Santa bhai ..
    Should we start a bashing session of Yuvraj Singh on his scratchy three off 21 balls before he was caught at mid-wicket..

    By Blogger Pankaj Tripathi, at 15:08  

  • Pankaj,
    Yuvraj doesn't need no bashing.. use pata hai ki uski lagi hui hai. my guess is that he will come good against SA.

    By Blogger santa_from_NJ, at 15:12  

  • With Michael Vaughan, who retired hurt for nought after twisting his knee .. I feel one warm up game to jump start the series may not be a bad idea.. More you play before the main series .. more probability of getting a mainlone player injured :-(

    By Blogger Pankaj Tripathi, at 15:14  

  • Santa .. Umeed pe duniya kaayam hi :-)
    Amen for your wishes ..

    By Blogger Pankaj Tripathi, at 15:15  

  • There was lot of talk about the inclusion of Kaif in another post. This is a no-brainer, the guy in the recent past has performed well, he gets injured, his job security should not be threatened. We don't want guys faking injuries to stay on the team or keeping someone out. Also, I do think he gives a balance to this side and for that alone, he belongs.

    No one talks about Yuvraj as much. This guy........what can I say? he is so disappointing. Can he string a couple of performances when he is not on the chopping block? I wish they would get rid of him.

    And I agree with many of you who have moaned the Badani career. It seems more often that quality Tamil players have had tragic careers.

    Here is what I would like to see for team composition (but I would guess it won't happen):
    Gambir & SRT
    Sehwag
    Kaif
    Raina
    Dhoni
    Pathan
    Harbajan
    Santh (Prem, you are more impressed than I am. Frankly, I think he needs more composure)
    VRV
    Agarkar (this guy has talent, and it is great to see him use it. Recently, he has frustrated me less with his decision making so this is probably the most reassuring thng about the series)

    I have excluded RD because of injury and rest. Can we book a ticket home for Yuvraj? Also, Kartik is disappointing. He has improved in some areas and worsened in others. But is still not the dangerous bowler we need.

    I am still not impressed by Rao. But Yadav should be given more chances, surely.

    By Blogger ahem, at 15:22  

  • Oh Prem, Do not do this again.
    You have done this to Agarkar and now Chandra?
    Why would we ever ever have to HIDE Chandra? In any match. One of the Best ever. Ahead of Pras and far ahead of Bedi in SR and taking wickets. Similar runs/wickets or better. An attacking bowler destined to take wickets ( as is Agarkar) Do you expect him to concede 2 runs per over like Gibbs and take a wicket every 90 balls?

    Kumble and HarB came on the scene much later. But Chandra cherished then and cherishable today. Unique too.

    By Blogger CrickTip, at 15:42  

  • Yacrick,
    Is in't it amazing that Agarkar is one of the top three bowler on the All Time List to hurry to 225 wickets (SR) and they talk as if there all half a dozen better bowlers sacrificed to give him a place?

    Do they know if everyone else took wickets like Agarkar there would be no opposition left to bat in the slog overs?

    Do they know that that 0.5 extra runs per over would add up 5 runs per his quota which he makes up with the bat anyway or with a catch or with a run out.

    Do they know!

    By Blogger CrickTip, at 15:57  

  • @cricktip

    exactly my thoughts on AA; anyone who questions AA is a cricket novice; Prem, with all due respect, is another
    jonny come lately types; he has jumped on AA bandwagon now that he has done it again.
    I though we could expect better from Prem :)
    He kept saying "need to see more on Rao" when from the very first match he showed he is useless.
    Now I expect Prem to come out and say Rao is useless (after he has been dropped!)

    By Blogger Yacrik, at 16:10  

  • on Rayudu - I think Prem is getting it not so right again.

    Rayudu of the captain when U19 team reached the world cup final. Raina,Utappa,Dhawan,Dinesh Kartik played there.
    One has alreay played Tests, one is in the ODI team,
    Dhawan and Utappa are pushing for national call up because
    of good domestic performance;
    and some still keep harping on Rayudu as the next big thing!
    give me a break...

    By Blogger Yacrik, at 16:21  

  • Why is Kaif ahead of the likes of Sriram and Badani in test match selection? The guys has a poor record in the longer version of the game. I hope Dravid brings in better judgement on selection to test team.

    I can see why SG wanted only MK and YS in the test team in his absence - he knew that they really wouldn't get a big score and threaten his place - but a Badani or Sriram would!

    By Blogger Prabu, at 16:22  

  • AT Rayudu 6 11 0 143 36 13.00 45.68 - -

    That's Rayudu last year in Ranji Trophy. No surprise that he hasn't been on the watchlist this year.

    The others have done reasonably well for their teams last year.

    I don't understand how Prem's already talking about Piyush Chawla given a chance in the Indian team! Has he really proved himself to be so prodigiously talented that he can skip all the steps in between?

    By Blogger Prabu, at 16:35  

  • LP Sahi on selection mtg:

    http://www.telegraphindia.com/1051108/asp/sports/story_5450257.asp

    Rao got dropped because Mohammed Kaif (93 not out and an unbeaten 102 in two of his last three ODI innings) simply had to be recalled once he regained fitness... Gautam Gambhir was set to go, but couldn’t be touched after his wonderful 103. If a Yuvraj Singh continues to fail, Rao is going to be back,” a well-placed Board source told The Telegraph here on Monday.


    Piyush Chawla:

    Called to bowl at nets...

    http://www.telegraphindia.com/1051108/asp/sports/story_5450490.asp

    By Blogger Rajg, at 16:36  

  • @ajit

    We don't want guys faking injuries...///

    are u privy to special insider news, or are the words of GC more believable to you than the reports of the team doctor and physio? just curious...

    By Blogger oldmanblues, at 16:55  

  • Hmmm....is this mere coincedence or do i see prem having a say in the indian team selection sitting in the yonder land !!!! :) . He gives a hint of one piyush chawla and by jolly 10 posts laters we hear news of this lad being summoned to the nets !!!

    By Blogger Realms, at 16:56  

  • i agree with ajit a batsman who has been form should be taken back otherwise people would hide injuries for the fear of losing their spot in the team

    By Blogger tombaan, at 16:59  

  • i still feel chawla should wait some time otherwise we have another prathiv patel on our hands who was to be the next gilchrist.

    chawla might become another hirwani or shivramkrishnan ,,,,if not handled properly. but bowling to seniors at net is good though

    By Blogger tombaan, at 17:04  

  • Shiva's problem was his own doing, he should have kept off all that dope to begin with..

    By Blogger Realms, at 17:11  

  • on Piyush Chawla

    Has been rated very highly - has alreay played in challengers (india's premiere one-dayers) and Duleep (the next thing to an India-A call up).
    so, no suprises there

    By Blogger Yacrik, at 17:12  

  • This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

    By Blogger Yacrik, at 17:19  

  • more on Chawla:

    He is a leg spinner - very rare breed; there are many off spinners and left arm spinners; but very few leg spinners to go around. If they find a reasonable leg spinner they will pick him out of primary school if need be:)
    that is the value placed on leg spinners - as simple as that !

    By Blogger Yacrik, at 17:21  

  • well mishra is a leg spinner and he is stillplaying for north zone

    By Blogger tombaan, at 17:26  

  • First-class 51 11082 5205 205 6/66 25.39 2.81 54.05 13 1
    List A 37 1818 1270 45 5/20 5/20 28.22 4.19 40.39 1 1

    By Blogger tombaan, at 17:28  

  • the above recordds are for mishra has taken over 200 wickets he deserves a break over chawlas and patels of the world

    By Blogger tombaan, at 17:29  

  • @tombaan

    amit mishra deserves a break? yes, he does and matter of fact
    he has one alreay. He has played for India 3 years ago - go check! I don't know how good he is or people think he is.
    but he has already played INT cricket for India !

    By Blogger Yacrik, at 17:51  

  • That wasnt a good enough break.. yacrik..

    But one has to agree, when Kumble and Bhajji are playing.. its bad luck to the rest..
    Yeah ODIs are the way to get fresh talent in..

    By Blogger Thanks Chappel, at 17:55  

  • on Piyush Chawla

    Anil Kumble: "he was very impressive. He holds a lot of promise and the coming domestic season with give a clear picture whether he has the potential to play for the country"

    In a Challenger trophy:
    Sachin Tendulkar b Piyush Chawla 22

    If you bowl out SRT, you are in ! no questions asked!!


    Earlier, he had impressed the master spin trio of Bedi, Prasanna, and Chandrashekhar at the BCCI's spin academy. And when Dilip Vengsarkar (head of Junior Talent Wing in BCCI) was asked to give one name that which he would tip for greatness from the junior crop, the name mentioned was none other than Piyush Chawla.

    Chawla first caught people's attention when he bamboozled the England U-19 team last year. The Indian colts whitewashed their English counterparts as Piyush took 13 wickets in 2 test matches, at an average a shade over 12. Even England's senior national team are poor players of spin, and Chawla's feat was not celebrated as it might have been. However, it was clear that an outstanding talent had been uncovered.


    http://www.sportnetwork.net/main/s119/st83668.htm?fromrss=1

    By Blogger Yacrik, at 18:03  

  • This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

    By Blogger tombaan, at 18:20  

  • really yacrik then all the ones who got sachin out should be in indian team. doesnot work that way. i think there is a lot of hype on chawla bandwagon and all are just joining in....
    to me a proved record like mishra cannot be ignored and he dd no wrong in his debut to be dismissed so hastily

    By Blogger tombaan, at 18:23  

  • The prodigy from Aligarh hasn't yet played first-class cricket, but going by his potential and performance it may not be too long before he plays Test cricket for India. However, caution must be exercised and the youngster exposed to the rigors of Indian domestic cricket and allowed to hone his skills before he is promoted to the highest level of the game. A nation looks forward to him.

    By Blogger tombaan, at 18:27  

  • tombaan,
    Actually, Chawla has now played 2 first class games
    So far:
    7 wickets at 20.57
    72 runs at 24.00 average

    By Blogger Sahir, at 18:48  

  • .. Can somebody tell me what the acronym IMHO stands for

    By Blogger indCric, at 19:23  

  • In My Humble Opinion, I don't know:-)

    By Blogger babi, at 19:26  

  • In my honest opinion, I dont know either :(

    By Blogger Thanks Chappel, at 19:27  

  • Why is the media making such a big fuss about Ganguly not makin his comeback into the team. Everyday i read something or the other on DADA in TOI and Telegraph (both of which are completely biased and have no objective reasoning behind their posts).

    If india is to become a serious contender for the beast team in the world then it can no longer carry players who rely on records and not current form. Anyway speaking of records loosing 19 0f the 20 finals he leaad the team is one distinguished record, and i cant understand why he is hailed as the best ever CAPTAIN India has produced.

    Coming to recent selection, i think Yuvi is one guy who is begining to belive he is an automatic choice even if he doesnt perform (cant really blame him, he was under ganguly's influence for too long). But its high time for him to perform to get out!.

    And why is Sunil Gavaskar constantly backing Ganguly, is it because Rohan plays under him or does he belive that by standing behind gaguly now, his son will be repaid in kind if the Dalmiya clout were to come back to power?

    By Blogger rahul_fan, at 19:46  

  • rahul_fan,

    yes, the guys who disagree with you must not have India's cricketing interest at heart, only some self-interest driven unterior motive.

    By Blogger bouncer, at 19:50  

  • Hi Folks. Breaking news !!

    Ganguly has been selected as Captain of Veteran's squad in a benefit match. Among others in the squad are Ajay Jadeja, Nayan Mongia, Nikhil Chopra, Nilesh Kulkarni, Javagal Srinath, Debasish Mohanty. Looks like Ganguly has finally found a permanent squad.

    By Blogger Gone_Guly, at 19:51  

  • TC, since you are here, I thought I should continue our friendly fire... would you kindly go back to the previous thread ... I have posted my responses and am eager to get your view... after all, there aren't many 'real cricket lovers' left here

    ;--))

    By Blogger oldmanblues, at 19:53  

  • And who says he was unceremoniously booted out :-)

    By Blogger babi, at 19:53  

  • @gone_guly,

    where was the news posted? I am really happy for Ganguly that he has got his aptaincy back......i hope he is happy now!

    By Blogger rahul_fan, at 19:54  

  • oldmanblues,

    I havent said that Bose or Paul should never have been selected.. Infact Paul was selected and was not found good enought by SG/JW combo.. Nobody can deny that Paul is fat and unfit.. He needs to do more..

    Now Ganguly was backing AN/ZK in the team.. IP is an automatic choice primarily based on his allround talent.. so there is no competetion regarding IPs place.. whenever He was played alongside, ZK and AN, he still came on top most of the time..

    Now Reason 1 - if ZK and AN has to be in the team, how do you get a new guy..

    Balaji is as good as Bose.. and we cant go back and say, hey in first 10 matches, that guy was better..

    On different points of their career, people go up and down.. and then their is luck.. especially with BCCI selection committee.. and the regionalism issues..

    Bose and Paul.. both are only bowlers.. not fielders or bats.. based on those skills, they have to be head and shoulders above the rest.. they are NOT. other are Bhandari, Balaji, AN, ZK , VRV, Gagandeep etc

    However I consider it very unfortunate that AN and ZK were persisted for such a long time without providing much of a performance at intl level.. other like Paul/Gagandeep/Bose/Bhandari should have been tried.. who knows what would have happened.. especially looking at these guys batting and fielding skills..

    As far as present scenario is concerned, here is my take

    IP is an automatic choice as of now.. He is automatic because others are not close enough.. overall

    AA - currently performing.. hence should be in the team unless he screws up again..

    This leaves two fast bowlers spots for -
    VRV/Santh/RP Singh/Gagandeep Singh/Bhandari/Bose/Paul/Balaji

    Santh looks like He is on his way out.. as he cant bat and field well.. same criteria.. He grabbed the shine in Challenger Trophey.. while others couldnt.. just like GG grabbed his chance.. Its bad luck for Paul and Ranadeb..

    I personally am looking forward to a fit Balaji and VRV.. and Gagandeep Singh.. as he has enormous statistics.. Cant understand why he wasnt even included in A and B team in challenger..

    By Blogger Thanks Chappel, at 20:31  

  • Why not Amit Bhandari - reasonable chance not yet given to AB?

    By Blogger FineLeg, at 20:37  

  • And what abt...
    AVISHKAR SALVI (AS)
    AS is a good bowler...infact his action was praised - smooth like Glen Mcgrath

    By Blogger FineLeg, at 20:37  

  • Agarkar & Co. don't have enough firepower
    India lost the Ahmedabad ODI mainly because the pacers RP Singh, Sreesanth and Agarkar did not have enough firepower. If India wants to build a powerful bench strength for the next World Cup it needs the services of Zaheer and Balaji who are experienced and still have a lot to offer to Team India. Zaheer has already played in one World Cup final and played in 103 ODIs bagging 152 wickets. He was the stalwart behind Team India's success in recent years, his absence will surely affect India

    By Blogger shaz220, at 20:42  

  • Here is the URL

    By Blogger shaz220, at 20:43  

  • >South Africa fast bowler Charl Langeveldt was also fined 75 percent of his match fee for failing to turn towards the umpire quickly enough when he appealed for the wicket of Hamish Marshall, who was caught behind for three.

    Doesn't that sound weird? Can't you appeal without looking at umpire? Fast bowlers spend all the energy on delivery - so much so that many a times they can't even bend down in follow-through to stop a ball. So why would bowlers need to turn to umpire - leave alone "quick enough" ?

    By Blogger LinkLover, at 21:02  

  • And on above post - would you also punish a batsman who does not look at umpire while umpire is delivering his judgement?

    By Blogger LinkLover, at 21:05  

  • ICC has become very snobbish

    By Blogger Glorious Uncertainty(GU), at 21:09  

  • TC,

    I guess at the least you can agree that SG was not really the monster that you and others have made him out to be, as a captain... if all selection responsibilities are to be laid on his shoulder alone, from the looks of it, he just went by his instinct... and probably by the performance in the nets... after all, as practically everyone agrees on these blogs, or at least used to till the time I posted the 2005 stats some days ago, that AA is a lost cause... and what do we all base our judgement on... what we see on TV of course!

    And yet, all four captains [MA, SRT, SG, and now RD] have persisted with him... so unless he curried sexual favours with all four and/or had the blessings of Bal Thakeray/Dawood Ebrahim, he should not have been in the team... unless, he actually impressed all four in the nets... that he is inconsistent beyond anybody's business is what we all can agree upon...

    So, if we agree that SG went by his instincts, we could with hindsight say that he might have been right or wrong, depending upon how we are disposed towards a particular player [ZK, AN]. Personally, I do think they are both very inconsistent, but way better than the current lot... and at the least, with AN, we have someone, who [if fit, and that is a big issue, I agree] can run through a side... in fact the only fast bowler currently who can... Now knowing that he has brittle bones, maybe we could use him like SA used Donald, ie sparingly [now I am not suggesting that AN=AD, but then India is also not SA, with their huge pool of potential fast bowlers...]

    Thus we can reasonably say that SG, in chosing ZK and AN over others, was not currying favours, for in that case who better could be his personal bum boy than his statemates, Bose and Paul... In fact I'd go so far as to accuse him of trying too hard to stick to his image of an impartial captain, by turning a blind eye to Bose and Paul, and in the process, almost losing India two potential fast bowling talents... Both are after all over 6.4 ft and bowl at a fair pace, and swing and cut both ways... going by media reports...

    So all that is left to solve [between us, that is] is who should be chosen in the future... Personally, I'd like to try out all of the above, since there is at least at the intl level, little to differentiate... and if some fail... they get the sack... fine...

    What I do not understand is your attitude that the Challengers should be the only criterion... and why should consistent performance over the seasons not be one... is it because that would ensure the two Bengalis to be kept out?

    In fact, I am inclined to believe so... Because your argument goes thus: VRV should be in because of Challengers, where Bose did not perform well and Paul was not chosen [along with Gagandeep], but Gagandeep should also be chosen because he has a better FC record...

    Wake up to your own parochial biases man!

    By Blogger oldmanblues, at 22:11  

  • TC,

    In effect you are sticking close to your namesake's policy... different criteria for different players, based on personal likes and dislikes... right?

    By Blogger oldmanblues, at 22:14  

  • But I'd agree about Balaji... he should definitely be given another try... what I don't understand is why he is out now... after all, the great monster who kept out all the southie worthies like Murali Karthik is now saftely out of harms way...

    By Blogger oldmanblues, at 22:16  

  • safely

    By Blogger oldmanblues, at 22:28  

  • Oldmanblues,
    Ganguly's problem is not his batting form only - his issue is being arrogant, telling lies within players, and then doing bossy-king like decisions. Overall his attitude as came to light more and more over the last few months...is appalling to say the least for Captain/player whatever. It is for this "Attitude" reason, more than anything else, that SG deserves to be out.
    Same negative/lazy attitude issues with Zak and AN.

    By Blogger Glorious Uncertainty(GU), at 22:34  

  • VRV and Sreesanth seem to have very honest attitude to try very hard, and are young folks who are getting a chance to display their wares...Thats all there is to it.

    By Blogger Glorious Uncertainty(GU), at 22:35  

  • oldmanblues,
    your logic is lacking. We, as cricket fans, can only go on our observations, what we pick up from the papers and we add our lifetime of reasoning power to decipher the mess that is Indian cricket. So when you go on about Ganguly, your reasoning power, like your logic, is lacking. His batting form though it was lacking was not the only reason, people wanted him out. It is because they could see (you like sexual metaphors that border on profanity, let me give it to you how you like it) that Ganguly was sucking some big elephant cock to stay on the team. They could also see that progress was not happening. Progress for a team sometimes sacrifices individuals. In its early stages, it has to experiment. So the individuals that were sacrificed for the team and the experiment was AN and ZA. Under Ganguly, it was clear that positions were already taken without really any reasonable method to evaluate whether that should be the case. ZA, AN, YS, HS -- all were given reserved seating. Part of this was noble, they had performed well in the world cup, after all we reached the finals. But another part, now again you have to use your power of reason, that if Ganguly reserved seats for some slackers, these slackers would give him his power. This is how corrupt governments, rulers, whaterver works. Give up on your old man blues, and let some of that old man's wisdom seep in.

    By Blogger ahem, at 22:55  

  • ///Glorious Uncertainty(GU) said...

    Ganguly's problem is not his batting form only - his issue is being arrogant, telling lies within players, and then doing bossy-king like decisions.

    VRV and Sreesanth seem to have very honest attitude to try very hard, and are young folks who are getting a chance to display their wares...Thats all there is to it.///

    Tell me, do you have private access to information that we ordinary mortals do not... If so, could you kindly share them with us... Or are you, like TC basing them on what you've seen on TV [coloured by ur own biases, I hope you will not deny]...

    Or could it be that you are basing your 'observations' on the slander campaign being run in general by Cricinfo [funded by Wisden... MCC... English... get it?] and their like, and GC [Ozzie establishment...?!?]...?

    As far as I recall, the BCCI accepted GC's accusations as false and SG's as true... And then there is the small matter of the motley 'SG gang' of HS, VS, etc who all came out in his support...

    By Blogger oldmanblues, at 23:03  

  • @Ajit

    ///your logic is lacking. We, as cricket fans, can only go on our observations, what we pick up from the papers and we add our lifetime of reasoning power to decipher the mess that is Indian cricket. So when you go on about Ganguly, your reasoning power, like your logic, is lacking.///

    Thanks for your Logic 101 lesson. Will try to remember that in the future...

    By Blogger oldmanblues, at 23:06  

  • yacrik,

    Ur logic on Piyush is totally screwy man. If you believe Vengsarkar or anyone said Piyush is poised for greatness, I really think you need to find out how our journalists operate (except our dear Prema). they make news out of nothing and basically twist words to convey what they feel.

    I totally agree with Tombaan. Piyush needs to go thru the rigours of FC cricket for at least one season before you can pass judgement on him. FYI, did you know S. Sriram was the most promising left-arm bowler in India back in the early 90s so much so that he captained under-19 team because of his bowling skills?? Sriram captained the under-XX team at all levels primarily as a left-arm bowler.

    You guys are so enamored by what you see on TV in a few matches that you are willing to declare anyone with one sexy ball - I really mean the ball they bowl - as the next big hope. Every veteran of this Indian team has gone thru at least one successful FC season before he was selected - that includes legends like SRT, RD and AK. This is the real tragedy of Indian FC cricket, the fact that most guys don't get to see what goes on in those matches on TV. Journos don't take the effort to go out and watch these matches and only decent reports are for the games on TV - which ensures maximum coverage and hence creates hype around people with very few performances. Poor Mishra - I remember the papers touting him as the next big hope - despite good performances in FC, people are only talking about Piyush Chawla only because he got SRT's wicket.

    By Blogger Prabu, at 23:27  

  • Oldmanblues,
    I really cannot understand that you will keep supporting Ganguly and totally refuse to see how destructive he has been to the progress of Indian Cricket.
    In order to see this there are three main things that you should have:
    1. You must want Indian Cricket's progress more than supporting any one or two individuals.
    2. You've got to be able to let go of individuals who may or may not have given "past glory" and have an open mind to experiment and/or look to the future (say,WC2007)
    3. You must emphasize POSITIVE ATTITUDE and HUMILITY first, and then combine that with Cricketing Skills as well.
    I don't think you are prepared to "Let-go of past glory"...man, as long as you keep hanging on to the "past glory", Future Glory is gone....Luckily, Greg Chappel and RD are trying to SAVE indian cricket from perishing.

    By Blogger Glorious Uncertainty(GU), at 23:27  

  • gu,
    Frankly speaking SG is dead wood already. Its only that Bengal never had any decent cricketer and SG was the only one ( who fucked up miserably). You may find it hard to believe but the only support SG is getting is from WB and that is it. This basically is a national problem.

    By Blogger J, at 23:38  

  • Balaji - Not for ODI's ...
    only for tests

    By Blogger rajesh, at 23:38  

  • gu,
    what these passionate SG fans cant undrstand is that we dont care about SG. if he has something to offer im not against seeing him back in the side - but if not i dont care what all he has done for us in the past if he is not going to do it now and in the future - u r rite, these are the ones who care more abt individuals than the team

    By Blogger GK, at 23:45  

  • j,
    dont quite agree - i know several non-bengalis irrational and passionate in support of ganguly ... on the other hand there are also some rational and sane bengalis who can see the truth

    By Blogger GK, at 23:47  

  • Agree with u gk- always feel both sides going to extremes- some fans want to keep SG no matter what and others want him out no matter what

    Just base it on performance and team needs

    By Blogger suraj, at 23:53  

  • I agree.
    its not bengali or non-bengali...really down to the 3 things GU said

    1. You must want Indian Cricket's progress more than supporting any one or two individuals.
    2. You've got to be able to let go of individuals who may or may not have given "past glory" and have an open mind to experiment and/or look to the future (say,WC2007)
    3. You must emphasize POSITIVE ATTITUDE and HUMILITY first, and then combine that with Cricketing Skills as well.

    SG,Zak dont figure if u go by this

    By Blogger FineLeg, at 23:54  

  • gk,

    u could be right but it does seem there is overwhelming support for SG in WB- almost to fanatic extent compared to the rest of the nation

    Regionalism I guess

    By Blogger suraj, at 23:55  

  • Somehow I have this feeling that in this SG debate one side has the logic, and the other blind biases and emotions, and therefore there is no dialogue really, only one way conversations.
    The use of 'dead wood', 'Bengal never had any decent cricketer' etc imply that SG was really fighting for a lost cause when he tried to move team selections beyond parochial whims. Regionalist sentiments still hold sway, not only over cricketing establishments and the media, but among general cricket watching public as well. This is sad, but true. I believe now that Ganguly, a Bengali, was tolerated until now because he had strong performance backing him, both as batsman and captain, and it was a foregone conclusion that he would be dumped at the first sign of apparent decline. If Ganguly's unfair ouster generates protest only from WB, then it is a national shame. It does seem that India is still not a nation.

    By Blogger devips, at 00:04  

  • devips
    I think you should run for office

    By Blogger Prabu, at 00:16  

  • devips - SG was our best batsmen in ODI's for a period of six months and this was about 5 years back. Since 2003 world cup, he has been doing everything except cricket. Nothing to show at all in terms of runs. In WB esp, people are as fanatic as in some of middle eastern countries. You will be lynched if you ever speak truth about SG in calcutta and ever noticed there politics? Will put lalus and yadavs to shame. And yes. They have been playing football for ages and we all know what results they have shown. point is as far as sports is concered, its an underachieving state and SG did provide some respite before he blew everythign himself. This is a sad truth but truth it is.

    By Blogger J, at 00:22  

  • j
    Your comment says it all. I should feel happy that the garbage you wrote confirms my contention. But actually it does make me sad.

    By Blogger devips, at 00:29  

  • I wonder why every ones fav whipping boy is AA.Here is man who has consistently won matches for India with his bowling in One days atleast.Ya he is inconcsistent but atleast on the day he is on he is a match winner which cannot be said about some of the others in the squad.To add to his is his fielding which is top class.Another thing about him is that he doesnt go to the media about how is working on his game and then bowl dross like Mr Zaheer Khan.I sometimes feel that some of the players owe their career to being Media savvy than being consistent performers.I mean Balaji had one good series and then got injured continously and yet people speak abt him but not AA.

    By Blogger bulchee, at 01:07  

  • Here is anyalysys which prooves kaif is an overrated player
    He has 2 hundreds and 14 fifties. Strake rate 74 is not great considering he bats very low or very high in the order
    His hundreds
    1 : 111 against ZIM. i know its under pressure. But this was agaisnt a pathetic zimbabwe side in sriankan wicket
    2: 102 agaisnt NZ. Although he scored it agaisnt newzeland, the match had no sigificance. Also shane bond was rested. Their attack withought bond is mediocre
    Of the 14 fifties, 3 against ZIM 1 agaisnt BD and 1 against WI
    That leaves us with 9 innings. We will go through them
    1 : 95 agaisnt SA. This was at flat dhaka wicket. And almost everyone scored in this match. Team scored 307. And Willoughby is the opening bowler for SA
    2 : 68 agaisnt NZ. India was chasing only 146 . Also he took 129 balls.
    3 : 64 agaisnt NZ. This was an okay innings. Took 108 balls though.. The match lost !.
    4 : 93 agaisnt NZ. This was also an okay innings. The match lost !
    5 : 51 agaisnt Eng. Took 73 balls while chasing 308. The match lost!
    6 : 50 agaisnt Eng. Took 79 balls. The match lost !
    7 : 78 agaisnt Pak on a Kanpur wicket.Dravid batted better than him. The match lost !

    So all these 7 are nothing average or below average. That leaves us with 2 innnings

    8 : 71 agaisnt Pak. I admit this is a good innings. But still it was Rahul dravid who took the game away from PAK. Dravid scored 76 and he was the one who started attacking initially.

    One thing to note is that he doesnt have a strike rate of 100 or above in any of those 15 innings. (The closest is 111 of 112 agaisnt a pathetic ZIM attack)

    So that leaves us with 1 innings

    9: 87 agaisnt Eng. I think this is the only great innings played by him in his entire career.
    But still he didnt do singlr handedly here.. I think yuvraj gets equal credit for this win.
    Of the 16 innings i mentioned this was the only innings his strike rate crossed 100 :-)

    So basically he is in the side for one innings.. Now tell me isnt he overrated?

    By Blogger idli vade, at 01:08  

  • Dont_Like_any_players_from_South.If_the_south_quota_is_abolished_North_India_will_only_represent_Team_india

    By Blogger Arya_nort, at 01:10  

  • I think Kaif is one of the most dedicated players around today.He probabaly has just half the talent that Yuvraj has and yet he has made the most of it.Also he has grown as a player cotinuosly.Also factor in his fielding which is worth 20 runs in every match and we have a good one day player.Similarly we have Mr SG who if he scores 50 costs us atleast 20 runs in the field.Effort matters my dear friend.I have greater respect for a player who will sweat blood then certail others who have a p[roblem with hard work

    By Blogger bulchee, at 01:23  

  • bulchee, i agee that he is a dedicated player and a great fielder. no one doubting that.. however the talent matters the most.. i believe there are lots a other talented players who were not given chances like kaif was given. who knows they might be more dedicated (or equal) than kaif.. how will u know that when u persisit one guy like kaif for ages for just one great innings.

    By Blogger idli vade, at 01:28  

  • My 2 cents worth about a few of the players being discussed

    1. Ajit Agarkar - He will always repeat the same mistakes over and over again, I cant believe that we have allowed him to play 100+ ODI's and he is still considered of GREAT POTENTIAL. He always manages 1 or 2 EXCELLENT performances in 20/25 odd ODI's. With the biggest issue being his inability to restrict runs on days where he cannot pick up wickets. He is an excellent fielder. He is a brainless batsman. My take is he does not deserve a spot on anyteam that is looking for world cup glory because he is a link that is SURE to fail at any point of time.

    2. Hemang Badani - Very talented but from the knocks that I have witnessed looked like a very selfish player, even if India lost I should get at least 50 kind of mentality. Besides I think Ganguly has certainly finished him off. I doubt if he will ever make it back.

    3. Mohammad Kaif - His fielding is the best part of his game. Batting is at best above average. Ideally suited for the late overs in ODI matches. My take is he will not succeed in test matches, I would love to be proven wrong here as I love the bloke for the energy he brings onto the field.

    By Blogger Swamy Cricathmanandha, at 01:34  

  • adding to my previous blogs
    His record agaisnt Australia : Played 6 matches. total score 20 with a highest of 10 and an avg of 5.00. That proves he is pathetic agaisnt good pace attack
    His record against Lanka : Played 12 matches. total score 206 with a highest of 41 and an avg of 25.75. That proves he is pathetic agaisnt spin attack too

    By Blogger idli vade, at 01:37  

  • Sure mate who are his replacements??Please suggest

    By Blogger bulchee, at 01:37  

  • S Sriram is another player who does not have the temperament to succeed at the highest level... he is a good bat in domestic cricket, a good fielder, a decent part-time bowler... but whenever given an opportunity in internationals he fails miserably in Batting, fields poorly... his bowling was probably better than his batting & fielding...

    By Blogger Swamy Cricathmanandha, at 01:37  

  • RD and Sachin back in top 10 for ICC ODI ratings

    Rahul 7
    SRT - 9
    MSD 24
    VS 25
    YS 34
    MK 35

    SG - 42
    Lax 57

    IP and GG have also scrapped in with 70 and 99 respectively.

    I think this should shut up VVS and SG fans as far as current form is concerned.

    By Blogger Rakesh, at 01:42  

  • I dont have a particular palyer in mind for replacment. Probabbly they could have tried rao for a few more matches. I am not a fan of rao. In fact i thought he was crap. But last series i watched him and he seemed okay. So they could have given more chances to rao and evaluate him.. Also there are a plenty of other players who cud have been tried. Uthappa is one playe who comes to my mind. I heard his technique is weak. But kaif's technique is not great either

    By Blogger idli vade, at 01:43  

  • Great .Really great do not have any ideas who the replacements are yet talk abpot dropping players.Wow mate !!Anywar Rao impressed me with his ability.There are small adjustments that he needs to make which I am sure he will make and make a comeback.Till then Kaif will do fine sir.And soembody spoke leaks runs then what about IP who gushes runs in end overs!!

    By Blogger bulchee, at 01:54  

  • I think Rao will be a good bet in Test Cricket... I agree with you guys that in ODI's he does not look as comfy... maybe he needs time but first impression...

    anyway its been a while since at least we guys could discuss spots on Team India, earlier it was always the same guys giving the same results to be followed by more of the same...

    bye for now

    By Blogger Swamy Cricathmanandha, at 01:54  

  • Oldmanblues

    What you said is in bold.. And my reply is in lined.

    I guess at the least you can agree that SG was not really the monster that you and others have made him out to be, as a captain... if all selection responsibilities are to be laid on his shoulder alone, from the looks of it, he just went by his instinct... and probably by the performance in the nets... after all, as practically everyone agrees on these blogs, or at least used to till the time I posted the 2005 stats some days ago, that AA is a lost cause... and what do we all base our judgments on... what we see on TV of course!

    And yet, all four captains [MA, SRT, SG, and now RD] have persisted with him... so unless he curried sexual favors with all four and/or had the blessings of Bal Thakeray/Dawood Ebrahim, he should not have been in the team... unless, he actually impressed all four in the nets... that he is inconsistent beyond anybody's business is what we all can agree upon...

    SG was a good ODI batsman till the one bouncer rule came to ODIs. That took him down. He couldn’t keep his eyes open when the bouncer came along. It became miserable with time.. And he lost all confidence as a bat. He didn’t make the right choices.. About his batting position.. with LAX's rise and Yuvi/Kaif increasing publicity, he became insecure as a batsman. He started the game.. favoritism.. playing with LAX's position in tests.. backing votes in the team.. it’s the greed that took him down.. greed to be the in control of power.. arrogance of showing kinds of Murali Karthik's the kick.. greed of money that fetches an Indian Captain 40-50 crores over a period of few years.. Whether you consider him a monster or a merely.. common human being with natural needs and instincts is up to you to decide..


    So, if we agree that SG went by his instincts, we could with hindsight say that he might have been right or wrong, depending upon how we are disposed towards a particular player [ZK, AN]. Personally, I do think they are both very inconsistent, but way better than the current lot... and at the least, with AN, we have someone, who [if fit, and that is a big issue, I agree] can run through a side... in fact the only fast bowler currently who can... Now knowing that he has brittle bones, maybe we could use him like SA used Donald, ie sparingly [now I am not suggesting that AN=AD, but then India is also not SA, with their huge pool of potential fast bowlers...]

    As far as AA is concerned.. he has kept everyone guessing for many years.. someday he looks great.. someday he looks worse that all you have seen before.. As far as ZK is considered, I dont think he has a bowler's heart and mind.. His mind is not fit enough.. He should be a NURSE by profession.. Anyone charges him and he pees in his pants.. a couple of boundaries you hit.. and he will win the match for the opposition..
    As far as AN is concerned, he is there to make money.. After IND-AUS(in AUS) series, he doesn’t give a rat’s ass to hard work.. its more-o-less like, when I can make money by bowling 10 overs in a day, why run after the ball in a test match for 5 days.. Anyway your assumption that AN can run through any side or a side is plain simple BS.. I have never seen him doing that.. may be the ENG match in world cup.. but you know that pitch and conditions in that match.. come next match against PAK, he was the worst bowler of the day.. He is so on and off that he wont let the team go beyond what we recently were.. I dont have to write a long para, but he just DOES NOT fit into Team India.. I will take anyone new above him.. atleast just for the benefit that other team does not know about my new bowler.. Even to allow other domestic guys who are sweating, to let them make few lakhs.. jus for GOD's sake.. and may be in hope that I may hit some kind of luck if not jackpot.. just to be a communist if I cant afford to be a capitalist..

    But if ZK/AN are going to lose me many matches.. why not give every fast bowler a chance.. just to be fair..


    Thus we can reasonably say that SG, in choosing ZK and AN over others, was not currying favors, for in that case who better could be his personal bum boy than his statemates, Bose and Paul... In fact I'd go so far as to accuse him of trying too hard to stick to his image of an impartial captain, by turning a blind eye to Bose and Paul, and in the process, almost losing India two potential fast bowling talents... Both are after all over 6.4 ft and bowl at a fair pace, and swing and cut both ways... going by media reports...

    I dont know Bose and Paul.. I have seen them on TV for a little time.. Paul was a fat bum.. he has good record.. May be we should have tried him.. why was he no in spite of being in the team.. I dont know.. who knows.. SG as a Bengali would love him.. I am not sure.. I dont like all the guys from my state or caste or even my family either..
    But we talk of today.. Bose and Paul are unfit to be in ODI team.. because they cant bat.. and because they cant field.. 2bad/3total.. as simple as that.. In test matches.. yes.. I am all for them.. But I am all for a Bhadari/Gagandeep/Balaji/VRV/Santh also.. but there are just two slots.. as IP/AA are certainty in the team as of now..
    AN/ZK have been paid for too long and they didn’t pay back.. so They need to go back to domestic cricket for atleast a couple of years.. they need to be good fielder or bats when we give them another look.. just their bowling is not good enough for them to have a place.. their on-off bowling can survive as long as we dont have other options and they deliver in atleast one of the other department.. just like IP compensates with the bat.. AA on the field.. that’s a minimum.. That’s why I think VRV is a good bat.. I saw him only once.. but my instinct tells me he has good chance of succeeding. if not today.. 2 years down the line..


    What I do not understand is your attitude that the Challengers should be the only criterion... and why should consistent performance over the seasons not be one... is it because that would ensure the two Bengalis to be kept out?

    In fact, I am inclined to believe so... Because your argument goes thus: VRV should be in because of Challengers, where Bose did not perform well and Paul was not chosen [along with Gagandeep], but Gagandeep should also be chosen because he has a better FC record...

    Wake up to your own parochial biases man!

    my answer to previous paragraph reflects my opinion to some extent.. And Challenger was on TV.. Based on our selector's past and some other selections in past, I cant decide by what stats are and what selectors say.. I like to see them on TV (This is strictly my opinion though.. kind of heart over mind).. I would love to have all prime matches in domestic cricket aired(Cant control that though).. People like Salvi came.. and I was shocked.. He had a good record too.. People like sunny Singh played for India B.. Only then I could figure out where they stand.. TV does some justice.. However Challenger is not the only criteria.. I would love to keep Bose in fray.. will ask Paul to lose 20 pounds first..
    As of now my bench is Bhandari/Gagandeep/Bose/Santh.. with 4 out of (IP/AA/VRV/RP/Balaji)in the main team based on form and utility.. One of my main guy will suck anyway always.. I will keep rotating the sucker with one in the bench.. as a permanent policy.. and lets see who cuts it both ways and who swings it..

    I am not biased for any region at all.. atleast that much I confess to myself.. I have nothing to do with the religion/region/caste.. I have nothing against anyone for GOD's sake..
    I just my team to win.. My guys to perform.. and payback for all we invest in them.. If they dont, they have to go.

    By Blogger Thanks Chappel, at 01:55  

  • bulchee, i said i dont have *a particular* player in mind. i mean they cud have tried someone from the talent pool. i had also named 2 crickerrs as an example.
    ok dude. i hope he will make that adjustments and will become a terrific player and lead india in both tests and odis in future :-) bye

    By Blogger idli vade, at 02:02  

  • TC,
    Whats that about Avishkar Salvi-u saying he is bad?
    I am interested in finding out...heard 2 years ago, he was like Glen McGrath bowling action

    By Blogger FineLeg, at 02:09  

  • Having Glenn Mcgrath Action doesnt mean you are Glenn Mcgrath's calibre :-)

    By Blogger idli vade, at 02:10  

  • What's up with Dinesh Mongia. He seems to a good utility guy. He can be used as a slogger and also blows some meagre overs. Moreover his form in the last season was noticable. So why is he being neglected. Does the management want all the 11 players to be new? I think he deserved selection.

    By Blogger sakya, at 02:16  

  • The talent pool that people talk about is practically empty.The only 2 consistent players in domestic who have combined talent with application and dedication are Dheeraj Jadhav and Rao.The rest like Uthappa are the blow cold blow hot variety.And I am including Raina ,Badani also in this list.Simialry bowlers are SS Paul and Bose.

    By Blogger bulchee, at 02:21  

  • Ofcourse, just Action does not make it GMcGrath - but, still Salvi was regarded highly for his potent bowling (not just action).

    I still have the question I asked earlier -
    " Whats that about Avishkar Salvi-u saying he is bad?
    I am interested in finding out..."

    By Blogger FineLeg, at 02:24  

  • ok.. i think that q is for the_chappel since he wrote salvi is bad.
    btw i have seen salvi in a few matches. recently agaisnt srilanka in the warm up match. i wont say he is bad. but he doesnt look good to me. he doent look like an internation quality bowler. didnt have pace and dint swing much either...
    anyways opinions differ...

    By Blogger idli vade, at 02:29  

  • dinesh mongia is history. he has had way too many chances and has just not stood up when it mattered or stood up at all.

    mongia, nehra, zaheer, ganguly are history. yuvraj may be go down that path though his fielding is saving him right now. bhajji seems ot have redemmed himself and the way he has been throwing himself on the field is noticable. Agarkar just got lucky in the 4th match. did you notice his weak body language in the last game. mentally he was tuned out when SL reached 200. more than anything he needs to work on his mentality. I also think Nehra has pissed of GC BIG TIME. He is a pretty good bowler but of course a liability in all other faets of the game.

    By Blogger MM, at 02:33  

  • Many won't agree, but politics is finding their way back into Indian cricket very fast!

    Forget SG, why keep Zaheer Khan out of the team when he is bowling like the best he ever did? And when you pick VRV (he could be good, I want to raise no questions till he fails) on the basis of the "recent" domestic performances, then why ignore Paul and Bose? And why have Murali Kartik and Sree Santh in a team which does not have a place for Balaji?

    Sree Santh and VRV might be able to bowl at 140, but so does a speed gun. Without direction and control, sheer pace has seldom made any sense. Otherwise Pattersons would have been better bowlers than McGraths and Akrams.

    And do you guys really think Venu Rao is good? Then I need an eye test probably.

    By Blogger Santanu De, at 02:41  

  • mm,
    why would u say agarkar was lucky in game 4 ? i saw that match live in the stadium and i can vouch that he bowled quite beautifully - superb swing with the new ball and perfect yorkers with the old

    By Blogger GK, at 02:42  

  • santanu,
    i heartily oppose all your observations

    By Blogger GK, at 02:44  

  • well , venu rao is solid agaisnt spin. he is yet to prove agiast a good pace attack.
    he did play a few cracking shots against maharoof though.. but maharoof is nothing but mahacrap..
    venu rao can be evaluated after he plays well agaisnt the quicks

    By Blogger idli vade, at 02:47  

  • hithere
    agree with u on venu ;-) surprise ... i must say he "looks good" when he plays his shots tho he may not have the figures yet in international cricket. sangakkara himself in his column said he is the brightest young talent in india and the experts here are saying his stance and technique resembles gundappa viswanath quite a lot

    By Blogger GK, at 02:51  

  • am wondering if there is any commentraror worse than ranjiith fernando? am seraching for the ans..

    By Blogger idli vade, at 02:56  

  • Hithere,
    Ranjith is (eeeeesss) probably very horrible.
    Infact I am sure it is (eeeeessss)

    By Blogger FineLeg, at 03:03  

  • santanu de
    You REALLY need an eye-test...You saying Zak bowling the best he ever did.
    LOL - I don't even want to comment any more!!!
    Zak is....I cant find a word ....what is it Horriblest....maybe I need to invent that word!

    By Blogger FineLeg, at 03:05  

  • Yes hithere,
    I wanted to know why Thanks Chappell says Salvi sucks!

    By Blogger FineLeg, at 03:07  

  • I think SG will be back in the test team. There are only a few batsmen who can play spin (world-class) better than SG. SG has shown in the duleep trophy game that he is working hard on his batting.
    Considering that Murali is the only major threat to India, we should pack the team with good players of spin.
    Gambhir, Shewag, Dravid, SRT, VVS, Ganguly should be automatic choices for test. I dont think YS will ever be able to play against good spinners. Kaif is a trier but he has not proven that he can play spin well. On what I saw, Venugopalrao is better than Kaif against Murali.

    By Blogger siddhu, at 03:11  

  • Yah , zaheer bowled well in the domestic matches. But i dont think he is a great bowler. He doesnt seem to have the variety. (He used to bowl good yorkers when he first came). He just hits the deck. He is not quick either. I think he has the ability to bowl quick. But rarely has he tocuhed 140.
    Overall a decent bowler. But i wud go for balaji instead

    By Blogger idli vade, at 03:11  

  • Zaheer Sucks. Period.

    By Blogger FineLeg, at 03:16  

  • hithere,
    If u saw the earlier thread , i also posted teh same things about kaif
    "KAIF IS REALLY AN OVERRATED PLAYER WHO DOES NOT DESERVE A AUTOMATIC PLACE OR IS ONE OF THE TOP 10 ODI BATSMAN IN INIDA"
    But a dedicated hardworking team man who fields brilliantly and runs for his partner too like his life depended on it ..........

    "LITTLE TALENT BUT TEAM MAN"

    By Blogger rajesh, at 03:18  

  • ZK is inconsistent bowler. But so is AA. I dont remember a single series (in the last 3 years) in which AA was consistent.
    AA was given so many oppurtunities to make come back. Why not give ZK another change to prove himself?

    By Blogger siddhu, at 03:19  

  • bulchee,
    we have lot of contenders for kaif's position
    1. badani
    2. jpy (mix of batting+bowling)
    3. GG or SG as an opener if kaif is dropped
    even vidyut ...

    By Blogger rajesh, at 03:22  

  • Siddhu may be more generous in nature - I sincerely hope our selection committee is not so generous. We need a winning team, and non-team players with big ego's like Zaheer need to be booted out, and we can only pray Selection Committee does that.

    By Blogger FineLeg, at 03:24  

  • I wonder if tomorrow I score a big hundred in first class will I get my place in Indian squad.I do not understand why people are clamouring for SG return to the Indian team so soon.He has played one good knock and failed in the other.Correct me people if I am wrong the challenge for a player at international level is to come up with good performaces consistently.There is no doubt that SG has class.The question is does he have the capability to score runs consistently against top class attack.I dont think that he has proved that as of now.If he has scored lets say 178,65, and 10 I could undersatnd it.But not now.Let the guy score runs consistently and then I will agree and ask why he is not in the squad.

    By Blogger bulchee, at 03:28  

  • My take on the test team for the SL series

    GG
    VS
    RD
    SRT
    VVS
    SG(Capt)...Will be his 50th Test as captain..Least India can do for him for all the muck that he has had to handle
    Karthick
    AK
    HS
    LB
    IP

    By Blogger Ravi1010, at 03:28  

  • fineleg, when u invest in something over a long term, you try to give it another shot. otherwise all ur investment is down the drain.
    I am not saying ZK is a great bowler, but he still has the potential to be a good bowler. He is trting hard and should be given one more chance. May be not in the next few series, but definitely a chance sometime in the future.

    By Blogger siddhu, at 03:29  

  • Bulchee...Yr argument than should hold good for VS and MK also

    By Blogger Ravi1010, at 03:34  

  • ravi, i agree with the batsmen. but LB has not done well lately. He needs some assistance from the pitch consitions to be effective. It will be a big risk to take IP and LB, both of whom rely so much on swing.
    It would be a good idea to try AA for one test and ZK/AN for another test. If we wrap up the series before the final test, it would not be a bad idea to try out some younsters like SS/RP/Bose etc.. in the last test.

    By Blogger siddhu, at 03:34  

  • Badani is a good player yet his domestic performance is consistent.If a palyer has to make a comeback then he has to score big runs comsistently.If you cannot be consistent domestic attacks what wull you dominate International attcak.My point is except that Jadhav and Rao has made a case for a slot

    By Blogger bulchee, at 03:41  

  • bulchee,
    If u say performance against SG ... Did u remember the alst 1 year nobody showed performance .. and kaif was persisted for around 35 oDI's without a single big score. Not even a first class big score i think (not sure though)

    Don't include SG in SA series also .. no problem .. LEt him play in domestic ,score runs ,come back into test team score runs and include him against Emgland and let us see how he fares ..
    If he fails against England .. biit SG .. no problem ...

    By Blogger rajesh, at 03:46  

  • I dont know if the discussion regarding the team for next ODI already started or not..But just got this news that Dravid is being rested for the next match. Now, I think this is a sign of lack of seriousness...Winning is a habit and they should not be getting relaxed so soon....
    And instead resting Sehwag they have given him the charge..u need to kick the guy where it hurt the most to get him back to the track..His form is misreable...

    God give some logic..

    By Blogger Medium_Fast_LegSpin, at 03:50  

  • ravi,
    I have teh following differences with u ...
    1. RD as captain and not SG (sg will remain as a player in test team)
    2. LB be booted out and one of teh fast bowling hopes be used like VRV,sreesanth etc (know it is a risk .. anyway indian fast bowlers don't take wickets in india lately)
    3. Dhoni in for karthik . if dhoni clicks we need to go with 5 bowlers ... Even thought karthick has done well in teh opp he got ... Hard but dhoni is a better bat

    By Blogger rajesh, at 03:51  

  • gk - agree that AA bowled really well in the 4th ODI. i meant he was lucky in that he has had his once in two years spell. my main gripe is that he is inconsistent, extremely inconsistent and more than that he seems to have a defeatist mentality when the chips are down. his expressions and body language give away more than any other player's.

    By Blogger MM, at 03:52  

  • abhay,
    where did you hear the news of RD being rested ?

    By Blogger GK, at 03:54  

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