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Sight Screen

Tuesday, November 15, 2005

Advantage Pak?(-worma)

Not yet, I would say....with their lead still only 115+ and given their propensity to collapse, and with this Eng attack..I would think a lead of 200 with these two (or atleast one of them) still around is when they can feel safe. If these two are around, then probably thats when Inzy will look to make his move..and accelerate a bit.

And it seems Flintoff was again the prime mover for Eng...repeating his Ashes effort of bowling his heart out(as he did last evening, to remove Younis). Although I am wondering if the situation was really so desperate last evening that Tresco had to open with Freddie? Probably too early in the tour to over-rely on him(and over-work him in the process)...and not showing enough faith in Harmison? Derek Pringle touches the same point in his report today.
It was a different matter when England entrusted the new ball to Matthew Hoggard and Flintoff, promoted in place of Stephen Harmison. Although unlikely to have been a unilateral decision by Trescothick, Flintoff failed to make the breakthrough. Instead, that came when Harmison, brought on for the seventh over, had Malik caught by Trescothick at slip with his second ball.

Meanwhile, Vaughan's chances of return for the second match have improved. I think England may need him desperately in the second match, even if they draw this one, forget losing. Ofcourse whom to drop if he does come in would be a tough call for Eng.

Anyway...sort of open thread for test proceedings...

update 1: meanwhile...read this entertaining report from Martin Johnson in Telegraph about events on day 3. Sample this about the state of the pitch, and prospects of Giles getting a wicket here
On current evidence, any further attempts by Giles to grow some facial hair would leave him looking like WG Grace by the time he takes a Test wicket in this country, as bounce and pace are essential for a spinner who, essentially, doesn't spin it. There's nothing much in the pitch for the quicks either. If a batsman spots a bouncer he can duck, get up again to see if the ball has arrived, and if it hasn't, duck again.

update 2: Hoggard and Flintoff turn on the heat with second new ball. Inzy, Yousuf and Raza off in quick succession and that likely Pak collapse has surely arrived again. And a draw, a more than faint possibility at lunchtime, is certainly out of question now. The interest point now would be how far can Pak stretch this, and how much of a fight can they give with a 200-ish lead. Ooh...Butt also gone, as I write this...and 200 is looking more like a dream now.

And I guess we can now say that Freddie's performance has proven a point to those doubting his effectivity in the subcontinent(?)


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    By Blogger Askinstoo, at 03:39  

  • Pak 299 / 7

    Butt Gone.

    Pakistan lead by 155 runs

    By Blogger Rishi, at 04:21  

  • "Advantage Pak?(-worma)

    Not yet, I would say....with their lead still only 115+ and given their propensity to collapse, and with this Eng attack."

    Looks prescient now worma! The new ball seems to have done the trick.... what a guy this Freddie is turning out to be...

    By Blogger CricLover, at 04:22  

  • yeah...we all can predict that much about Pak ;-)

    By Blogger worma, at 04:27  

  • This on the main post by Ruchir...."Arjuna Ranatunga is not a quick learner. He just keeps on throwing his arrows aimlessly. Most of his column is dedicated to Ganguly"
    What is aimless about this??
    Why should you take offence to this and put your views as those representing the blog?
    If you are posting on the main page...please maintain an unbiased approach...One can see the perceptible difference in what WOrma posts and what you do...U still have a long way to go

    By Blogger Ravi1010, at 05:26  

  • ravi1010 i agree but we all know that none of us(u included) can be totally unbiassed.

    By Blogger K-Slice, at 05:32  

  • shoaib playing a VALIANT innings - 5 in 40 balls

    By Blogger GK, at 05:32  

  • @Ravi

    I think Ruchir was right in saying whatever he likes. Infact i agree with him that Arjuna Ranatunga is just farting aimlessly in the indian public and creating all non-sense.


  • honestly
    if readrs of the blog are not gonna allow the writers to present their own views ... it is weird

    By Blogger GK, at 05:36  

  • It seems SG told his team mates after the Duleep Final that he kept his loosing streak in the finals intact with a smile.



  • pak 332/9 looks like its gonna be easy after all

    By Blogger GK, at 05:44  

  • Pakistan 9 down...

    By Blogger Saurabh Wahi, at 05:44  

  • Wallet: Unfortunately, self-mocking irony is lost on you. Doesn't matter, at least you still have that wallet.

    By Blogger i, at 05:47  

  • gk, this can be a tricky total for England, especially since they will have to play tonight and tomorrow morning - which are the trickiest sessions in Multan.

    Chasing a small total, they might be inclined to go for their shots and pay the price.

    But all indications are they should win this one...

    By Blogger Saurabh Wahi, at 05:48  

  • you wallet man,
    i think it was a great joke to crack. how the fuck can you call a man who actually managed to take his team into finals so many times a loser? i mean dud eto lose a final yopu need to get there dont you?

    By Blogger K-Slice, at 06:06  

  • i sir,
    where on earth have u been sir?

    By Blogger K-Slice, at 06:10  

  • well unless england trulu decide to screw to pooch in the next 18 hours they should be ebale to go 1 up in this series.
    what a way pakistan have screwed the pooch though.
    bechara pooch. its like a dhobi ka kutaa screw either ways.

    By Blogger K-Slice, at 06:16  

  • woo hoo...Tresco gone :-)...saurabh...nervous?

    By Blogger worma, at 06:23  

  • worma
    its just one down. not 10. chill mate 9 more to go.
    fuck now even i am nervous!!

    By Blogger K-Slice, at 06:24  

  • Dear slice, have been hanging around waiting till I can go back and speak hindi for a change. I am sick of conversing in Anglais

    By Blogger i, at 06:27  

  • the audacity of ian bell - pulling shoaib for a 6 at the fag end of the day

    By Blogger GK, at 06:27  

  • oye i yaar, i understand your plight. i was stuck in the midwest for 6 years. couldnt wait for every summer or winter vacans so i could come back to india

    By Blogger K-Slice, at 06:33  

  • k-slice...yeah 10 down won't need chilling..right? :-)...but seriously...good start from Pak I would say...Strauss looking very edgy (ok...not 'looking' but seeming...as I'm not watching)

    By Blogger worma, at 06:35  

  • worma worrma worma,
    let pak lose this one mate. it gives me mad joy to see the pakis one down and then coming back to alaughter opponenets. i think that team perfoprms best when they are cornered. reminds me of a certian yuvraj singh. i guess the proximity of punjab and pak plays a role there?!?!?!

    By Blogger K-Slice, at 06:40  

  • I can't decide which one to root for, or rather root against. Both are loathsome. Sigh.

    By Blogger i, at 06:42  

  • k-slice...frankly I don't care which one of them wins...as long as its a good match. Ohh..ok...dropping the facade....make it 'as long as none of them gain a psychological upper hand before facing us' :-)...I want Strauss to fail...KP also kept down....Bell etc are ok to handle anyway. And Freddie is anyway impossible to supress in current form.

    Yes ofcourse its great sight to watch a fightback....guess I'll indeed be getting up early tomorrow morning atleast...have been lazy all this while

    By Blogger worma, at 06:44  

  • Bhairo Singh said...
    steak sauce, you are sick man. When Ganguly didn't bowl much, he was blamed. Now that he's bowling and bowling well and taking wickets, then also you blame Ganguly. Just leave him alone. He is not part of Team India now, give him a break.


    GK said...
    bhairo, u know the latest score in dulleep ??


    Bhairo Singh said...
    WZ, 39/3 needs another 136 runs, both the openers and Jaffer gone


    Jiet said...
    Donna says no more ducks...Mrs. Ganguly is fed up having the same thing every day.

    Too bad....Ganguly can't make anything else


    Jiet said...
    Paki bowlers are playing with their hair...so cuute!!! LOL

    These guys are such dorks.


    Shivam said...
    naach bhairo naach...tera pyara gangly test team se bahar rahne wala hai


    Shivam said...
    Bhairo tere liye khas peshkash,

    Ganguly is leading wicket taker and strike bowler from East Zone side...In
    1992 he came as bowler...then made a comeback in 1996 as a batsman...this
    time again he will be coming as a strike bowler.

    Zaheer bowls him out in both innings. Ganguly out for very first delivery by
    Zaheer Khan in the 2nd inning.

    1st innings: SC Ganguly b Khan Runs 0 (Balls 7)
    2nd innings: SC Ganguly b Khan Runs 0 (Balls 1)

    Of course this is a bad performance in a Final by a batsman who is captain.
    But thing to be noted is the following,

    Bowling O M R W
    Paul 16 5 21 1 (2nb)
    Bose 12 1 34 1
    Ganguly 19 5 45 3
    Nadeem 5 1 15 1
    Lahiri 12 3 35 4

    Ganguly is second best wicket taker from East Zone and he bowled the maximum
    number of overs. Great prospect of his returning as a bowler who can bat a


    Bhairo Singh said...
    another idiot bringing Ganguly's wife into discussion. So disgusting these guys are. Can I bring your mom or wife or sister into the discussion here?


    squarecut said...
    SG trying hard for wickets

    5 1 15 0 3.00


    Bhairo Singh said...
    aare shivam, tu to apna baap ko bhi dhakka maarke ghar se nikal ne wala hai jab woh buda ho jaaye. No wonder you have already forgotten about Ganguly's achievements.


    Shivam said...
    Bhairo nacho...

    Important match+world class bowling-->Ganguly's duck...now he is one of the best bowlers of india who can bat a bit (after scoring 15,000 runs, now suddenly he has transformed to a bowler...to make a place in india he can change any form)


    Bhairo Singh said...
    do u mean other bowlers are not trying for wickets?


    Shivam said...
    nach bhairo naach,

    haan sale tu apne pair kate baap ko jo ki pak ke against ladai me pair kho gaya ho...use war ke time bhej dena...tu apne baap ka pahle sochna aur ye mat sochna ki uski wazah se desh pak se har gaya to kya hoga....


    Bhairo Singh said...
    shivam, tu mere baare mein chinta mat kar. Main toh nikat vabishya mein naachnewala zaroor hoon jab ki tera toh vat lagnewala hai. Soch ke rfakh Dalmiya ko ya kisi aur ko blame karega.


    Shivam said...
    saale tere liye desh bad me ata hai...pahle tu jiska fan (pankha) hai uska sochega...tujhse 6-1 se jitana hua india achchha nahin lag raha...tujhe to last 1 year ki dasha achchhi lagi hogi...yaad kar ganguly ko...saale agar wo steve waugh ki tarah sahi samay par ghar ka rasta dekhata to main kya sara india uski pooja karta...lekin agar koi sab kuchh hasil karke uske upar peshab kare to sirf tere jaisa launda hi dance kar sakta hai...

    isliye nach bhairo naach...


    squarecut said...
    Flintoff and Tres pulversing pak. good going Eng 337/5


    Shivam said...
    saale bhairo tujhe ya tere Ganguly ko sharam hoti....to uska statement ye ata....

    I am really happy with the way india is playing and i too want to first see if i can really serve my country or not and then would like to make it to the indian team....

    saale 10 sal indian team ka imp part hone ke bad aur 5 saal captainship karne ke bad...apni izzat ko dhul me milane ki kya jarurat hai? field me utarata hai to boos kyun paata hai?? gracefully nahin raha sakta tha??

    bol jamure bol...
    naach bhairo naach....


    Jiet said...
    please bhairo ...you are so scary...don' bring my wife into this discussion

    thank you...thank you.


    Now where were we...

    Oh yeah...Donna says that Zaheer is no longer welcome at their home.


    Shivam said...
    dekho bhai...

    Ganguly ne sabkuchh pakar jis tarah se dhool me milaya hai...aur izzat ki bilkul parwah nahin ki hai...to aise insaan ke liye uski wife ka naam lao ya kisi ka bhi lao...kuchh farak nahin padta...izzat khud hi kamai jati hai aur khud hi gawai bhi jati hai...2003 tak bhi uska form bahot achchha nahin chal raha tha...tab bhi desh use chahta tha...lekin natak ki bhi had hoti hai...jab dekho tab natak...jab dekho tab apne kenya aur BD aur Zim wale runs gina raha hai...aur kahta hai ki wo Yuvi aur Kaif se better hai...last two years me usase ghatiya to whole wolrd me koi cricketer nahin hoga...jo bolna hai wo bolo...


    Shivam said...
    Ganguly ne country ke sentiments ke sath khela hai...aur cricket ko almost duba dene ki koshish ki...kabhi BD ke series me bhi khud ko bahar rakh ke dusron ko mauka nahin diya...youngsters ko back karne ke liye Ganguly ka naam liya jata hai...kabhi usne youngsters ko back nahin kiya...wo bas apne chamcho ko back karta tha...aur Yuvi abhi thik se nahin khel pata usme bhi usi ka hath hai...jab yuvi ke sikhane ke din the tab usne extra backing karke uski life barbad kar di...abhi halat ye hai ki uske jaisa talented batsman useless lagta hai...harbhajan ko bhi useless bana ke rakha tha...Indian Cricket ko kisi ne uthaya to wo hai Ganguly aur Dubaya to wo bhi Ganguly...isliye us selfish insaan ke bare me jise jo kahna hai kahe...


    Bhairo Singh said...
    jitna chahe Ganguly ki burai kar, uski biwi ko bhi la apne gandegi mein. Ganguly ko koi fark nahi padta, lekin tere parvarish ke baare mein zaroor kuch pata chalta hai. Tere jaise lund fakir apne maa bahen ka izzat dao par lagata hai. Thukta hoon tere jaise nmard par.


    Shivam said...
    aur naach sale kutte bhairo...aur naach...tujhe aur tere Gangu ko farak nahin na pada sare desh ka interest cricket se khatm ho chuka tha to...aur SL me 51 run banakar RD ki captaincy wapas lene ki sajish karke?? aur 101 runs jo Zim me banaye usme kitni badboo thi...wo nahin dikhta tha tujhe??? choos sale uska jitna choosana hai...


    Shivam said...
    thook kutte ya moot...jo ho sake wo kar...lekin iss kutte ki burai karunga...kyunki wo joke ki tarah team se chipka hua tha...indian cricket se ye chipkugiri hatani hi chahiye...sara desh cricket se itna pyar karta hai ki kisi ek ko ise apni jagir samajhne ki izazat nahin di ja sakti...


    Shivam said...
    shane bond ke samne opening karne aya tha...aur sare desh ki izzat bandar ki tarah dance karke dhool me milayi...aise ghatiya insaan ko jo ki ekbar thik se indian team ke win pe tarif bhi nahin kar sakta...aur muh lakkaye fir raha hai...uski tarif karta hai saale ...dub ke mar ja...


    Bhairo Singh said...
    karta reh karta reh.....dekhta hoon kitna din tera hausla buland rehta hai. chal mooh khol, mootna hai. haan ab thik hai, bludder khali, abhi sone jaata hoon. Subeh phir mooh kholna, sandas karna padega.


    Shivam said...
    GC jaisa insaan jiske paas ki definitely ek vision hai (chahe aur jo bhi burai ho usme)...usase koi indian team ka bhala chahne wala jhagda kar hi nahin sakta...GC kuchh naya try karna chah raha tha...hum 1 sal se hare ja rahe the...ek wicket girata tha to dusra (gangu) bhai ka to gira hi rahta tha...aise me harate ja rahe the...ab GC kuchh try karna chahta tha...to Gangu ki fat kyun rahi thi???kya usi ke khelne ke liye indian team bani hai ya sare desh ko represent karne ke liye team bani hai...

    Bata na bhairo sale..


    Deepak said...
    you have raised some very good points about Yuvi vs. Kaif. I agree that Yuvi has sharper reflexes than Kaif which makes him a better candidate for facing pace bowling. And this talent is something which is innate and cannot be aquired (nature vs. nurture argument). If Yuvi works a little bit harder on playing spin, he can learn this art as well. Some of it was in display already in the Rajkot match where Yuvi used his footwork a lot against spinners (which I have seen him do for the first time against spinners). But the same cannot be said of Kaif. He has always, I repeat always, struggled against pace bowling. And I am sorry to say that no matter how hard he tries now, he can never learn this.


    Shivam said...
    madarchod india se bahar rahta hai...fir bhi desh se pyar nahin?? ek andmi ke pichhe homo bana firta hai???mujhe laga india me hi kahin pada hoga...nalayak kahin ka...ja uska muh me lekar so jana...ab batsman se bowler ban gaya hai...age bhi sahi hai bowler me tabdil hone ke liye...bas 34 ke hi kareeb hai...


    squarecut said...
    bhairo and shivam stop fighting SG is a history and waste your time on him


  • yeah worma, thats what sahir and i were discussing earlier. but i guess since we go to pak fiorst and then to eng it makes sense for the poms to beat the pakis and have them in a shitty mood.
    wow i just stepped back for a second and read what i had just wriiten. i do sound like a self important all knowing prick. well not all of us can be perfect i guess!!

    By Blogger K-Slice, at 06:46  

  • k-slice: actually I figured out that I want both to do bad....Pak to win a game or so...but lose another one badly...and Eng batting to be specially kept quiet. Yeah...dreaming...I know :-)

    By Blogger worma, at 06:49  

  • dude wallet,
    whats your point?

    By Blogger K-Slice, at 06:51  

  • worma
    i just want to see a really close match ... and a series ... dont care abt anything else

    By Blogger GK, at 06:51  

  • worma
    whats the plan for tomorrows game ? here or reconfigured DG ? and is prem gonna be able to take part ?

    By Blogger GK, at 06:52  

  • gk..plan for tomorrow is here only, as far as I know. Prem mentioned yesterday that he would be keeping an eye on comments and making his contribution on main posts (said 10 over slot, if I remember correctly).

    By Blogger worma, at 06:54  

  • Should be an interesting day's play tomorrow.

    England have the edge IMHO, mainly because the pitch still looks so blameless.

    Very nervy half hour just now but that was to be expected.

    If England can get through the first hour relatively unscathed, they should be able to knock off the rest of the runs against an ageing ball.

    Shabbir and the spinners look the boys most likely to cause some jitters, but England should be good for 174 runs with 9 wickets in hand.

    By Blogger Ged, at 07:08  

  • Guys,
    Finally managed to get tickets for Ind-SA match at Hyd. Though I must say that my mind will be meadering to Multan as well :-) Hope Pak give a tough fight. Will come back here to share my experiences after the match.


    By Blogger Deepak, at 07:22  

  • wallet beware of the kolatta market place, the pickpockets are desparetly seeking you man. sg took a team walloped by the aussies in the first match of the tournament right into the final of the tournament. and if it weren;t for some wayward bowling you would have done the kepp shut act my main man. as for this duleep trophy match, its very clear that east bengal as a team just did not have the person to person match-up against the big guns of west zone. yet they gave a big fight inspite of sg scoring 00. maybe they are inspired by their captain, maybe they are not again. but you definetely are on a need to know basis and you certainly don't need to know.

    By Blogger achu, at 07:40  

  • This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

    By Blogger idli vade, at 08:14  

  • What a terrific player freddie is..
    I wud say he is better than harmi/hoggard in bowling.
    Btw he had inzi plumb infront this morning when he was on zero. But the damn umpire didnt give.

    By Blogger idli vade, at 08:17  

  • Guys,

    Why do we hope that England lose to Pakistan and vice versa so it benefits India?

    We should have confidence in our ability to win, no matter the result of this series.

    As they say, "Lets worry about our game".

    By Blogger Saurabh Wahi, at 08:26  

  • saurabh dude,
    i dont mind india loosing to england..
    but will mind england loosing to pakis

    By Blogger idli vade, at 08:29  

  • nakshathrika,

    even I want England to win but thats not my point.

    Why should we worry about the result of this series to help India win the subsequent series.

    Like I said, we should be confident enough to beat whoever and in whatever form...

    By Blogger Saurabh Wahi, at 08:36  

  • I hate idiotic headlines like this

    "Flintoff confident of England win"


    Next what?

    "Inzi confident of Pak win"...

    By Blogger Saurabh Wahi, at 08:41  

  • Saurabh....How abt..."SG apologizes to GC...back in Team India"....:)

    By Blogger Ravi1010, at 08:49  

  • I agree with Saurabh, we shouldnt be bothered about the result and carry the confidence from the current ODI showing into the test matches.

    If the english batsmen can go through the initial one hour without many wickets then i would back England winning this test.

    By Blogger Hemal, at 08:59  

  • Saurabh Wahi said...
    I hate idiotic headlines like this
    "Flintoff confident of England win"

    Yup, it is as meaningful as "Pope confident that he is a Catholic", "Weatherman confident that the sky is blue" or "park ranger confident that bears defactate in the woods"

    To be fair, the article itself is OK, although these mid match (and even post match) pieces tend to be all-too predictable.

    By Blogger Ged, at 09:02  

  • Guys....just chill..there is much more happening around us than just cricket


    By Blogger Ravi1010, at 09:04  

  • LOL :-)) After 80 overs it looked like a dog had chewed it Freddie on the state of the ball

    By Blogger worma, at 09:07  

  • Something great is going on between RD and GC.

    RD told media that everyone, inclduing himself, knows who is the boss.

    GC next day told that this is RD's team.

    They are in love !

    By Blogger SS, at 09:11  

  • Worma,
    did you look at the great India-SA dossier by Rediff? Eye-opener for SG bashers!

    By Blogger SS, at 09:12  

  • ss: I don't believe anyone's eyes are closed on this one...some may choose to ignore...but what's the point. These are not revelations really...all records are out there to be accessed by anyone interested

    By Blogger worma, at 09:20  

  • ss,
    Check the dates when SG scored the centuries, a good 4 years back. I can take Sunil Gavaskar's record and say that.

    Current form is what is important. You very well know that, dont try to bring out records and prove someting which you cant. Ganguly was good and currently he isnt. Period.

    By Blogger Hemal, at 09:21  

  • hemal

    That was exactly my reaction. The records were an eye opener for me. SG was great in 2000-01 maybe but that was 5 years ago. I think 5 years ago Deep Dasgupta had a 100 in a test match. I wonder if that means he should be in the team now ... hmm ...

    By Blogger Gopalblog, at 09:41  

  • @hemal, gopal:
    wonderful reaction. That stat is an eye-opener for those who go on saying that SG was good only against the minnows. There have been too many posts on this board regarding this. As I've said, current form is not at discussion..no one is a fool.

    But ppl try to extend current form to whole career...that is blasphemy man.

    By Blogger SS, at 09:54  

  • ss - you're right! I'm not joining your pro-SG camp but I agree with your analysis.

    By Blogger Gopalblog, at 10:01  

  • @gopal,
    For that matter, in the last ODI matches against SA ( 2003), SG had an average of 73.5 in 3 matches( TVS cup)....75/61/11*.

    We are sure not talking about Sunil Gavaskar's time!!!!

    By Blogger SS, at 10:08  

  • @gopal,
    For that matter, in the last ODI matches against SA ( 2003), SG had an average of 73.5 in 3 matches( TVS cup)....75/61/11*.

    We are sure not talking about Sunil Gavaskar's time!!!!

    By Blogger SS, at 10:08  

  • With Trescothick gone. ENG may be in trouble..although the asking is not too tall..174 is okay with 9 wickets in hand.

    We may have tough time against PAK...playing well again.

    By Blogger SS, at 10:13  

  • Yeah agreed, his record speaks for itself and he was great but looking at the current situation, dont think he can get back. The 2 ducks in the Duleep trophy final wont help either. But this doesnt mean that he wasnt great. He was and the insult by many is uncalled for.

    By Blogger Hemal, at 10:15  

  • I think we'll put up a much more consistent show against India at home this year then we did last time - just a feeling I have - and that feeling I have regardless of how we'll do against England.

    It we win this, it'll be some achievement. If we lose, I hope we only lose it after after a real good fight - that way we'll be in better frame of mind for the next test at Faisalabad. I'll not rule out a tie either - this England team have a knack of producing epic test matches. :)

    By Blogger Zainub, at 10:36  

  • Please no, Zainub!!

    My nerves have still not recovered from the Ashes.

    Worse, I am having some vaccination jabs tomorrow at 9:30 GMT (just before scheduled time for tea). If the match is in the balance then, and I'm shaking like a leaf, I dread to think where the needles might go ;-)

    By Blogger Ged, at 10:53  

  • yeah..me can also do without the tense moments...what with the whole match coinciding with work hours...and on top of it an India-SA match to follow...please..lets have a clean swift end to this. I'm even ready for a rip-through early up by Shoaib and company.....and we'll see about that how ready Pak is to face Ind later :-)

    By Blogger worma, at 11:24  

  • I think I'd prefer an amble at 3.5 an over towards a seven or eight wicket win if that's OK.

    By Blogger Ged, at 11:50  

  • ged: you wish! when was the last time Eng made it so easy on themselves :-)

    By Blogger worma, at 12:13  

  • Batting last? Port Elisabeth just before Christmas last year.

    When was the last time anyone got an easy win batting last against the Aussies?

    By Blogger Ged, at 12:23  

  • Yeah, I did think of that Port Elisabeth match...200 odd for 3 right? To be frank, Eng do keep their heads about better than most teams while chasing, and that goes for ODIs as well (wasn't it recently that they were accused of being unable to set targets in ODIs...only chasers!).

    And yeah, right too....about no-one having it easy against Aus batting last. I think WI chasing a 400+ total in dead rubber in their last series in Carribean is the best example I can think. Otherwise its always been tricky...whether Eng chasing at Trent Bridge, or India at Adelaid, Chennai.

    By Blogger worma, at 12:42  

  • but, and this if you are watching the game rather than comparing scoresheets, they do have a knack of making it hard on themselves when in comfortable position

    By Blogger worma, at 12:43  

  • Apart from Aus - who doesn't?

    By Blogger Ged, at 12:45  

  • Now that I will contest. I don't think this current Indian test team hands over the initiative from strong positions as easily as Eng does. Ofcourse the current Eng team is overall a better team than Indian, so it 'creates' more of such situations. But its a different matter of how you handle it, when you've got it.

    I have not followed the other teams test exploits as well, but I have a feeling that its not the case with SA and WI either..that they don't let go, if and when they get the hold.

    Anyway, for me, its Eng, Aus and Ind which are going to be fighting for the top slot in near future...so worth comparing them.

    By Blogger worma, at 13:49  

  • Not sure about your analysis on England c/w other teams. 2004 and 2005 so far England have been trounced twice, have drawn well two or three times but otherwise have won well on the whole, pre Ashes. 2001, 2002, 2003 while England were improving but not there yet it was far more of a rollercoaster ride, e.g. our last couple of series v India.

    I certainly agree with your last point and look forward eagerly to the spring series in India. It will test England a great deal, I expect. India has more strength in depth than Pakistan IMHO.

    By Blogger Ged, at 14:40  

  • ged, its not about losing...more about making it hard on themselves. For example this entire Ashes series....you should have comfortably won 3-1. From its position of relative comfort, Eng managed to let Aus draw one, almost do it again! And then this one here in Pak.

    By Blogger worma, at 14:52  

  • and before you say its Aus...do remember that, as I said, I mainly compare with India and I don't remember us letting them get out of a tight spot in recent times. Against Pak as well when we were in strong position, we closed the game well and truly for them each time.

    I hope you are able to see the point..?

    By Blogger worma, at 14:54  

  • hmmm....

    Aussies I think I covered above as an exception and they make it hard for everyone.

    This game v Pakistan, I happen to think that Pakistan seriously botched their first innings and that their second innings score was closer to par. If England have let anything slip this game, I think it was Fred's soft dismissal followed by the poor showing for the last 4 wickets when we batted. I thought 450 to 500 was on. My view is that the wicket still holds few demons and that a level-headed England should close the match out pretty well tomorrow. Hope I'm right!!

    Interesting aspects to chat about BTW - I'm enjoying it. But need to finish work, eat and sleep now.

    By Blogger Ged, at 15:00  

  • But before I work, eat and sleep - picking up on your point comparing with India - I think you might be right.

    But this is gut feel stuff. I'm trying to work out what stats or formal analysis could support your points.

    I'll sleep on that thought.

    By Blogger Ged, at 15:03  

  • ged, for ths Pak match its the missed chance while batting that I'm also talking about. And I thought you covered the Aus exception only for your chase at Trent Bridge? :-)

    But hey, nice to chat...am always on for any real cricketing discussion. Catch you later sometime, even I've to get up at horrible hours to catch both the matches (this one and Ind-SA ODI)

    By Blogger worma, at 15:06  

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